Hello
My name is Paul Holdsworth, and I work for Living Streets (www.livingstreets.org.uk). Living Streets has been commissioned by Lewisham Council to conduct a Community Street Audit of Sydenham Road. This is to further develop plans arising from the successful Area Based Scheme proposal for Sydenham.
I know it is very short notice, but I'm hoping to meet some influential locals at the Greyhound at 1pm this Thursday 2nd November, to help get me up to speed with local opinions and concerns surrounding this exciting project.
If you want to know more about Community Street Auditing, and/or think you can help me to understand Sydenham, especially from the perspective of people on foot, then please reply to this message and come along on Thursday.
Paul Holdsworth
Living Streets
Sydenham Road Community Street Audit
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Paul Holdsworth
- Posts: 1
- Joined: 31 Oct 2006 20:20
- Location: Kendal, Cumbria
Hello and welcome to Sydenham.
Unfortunately I’ll be at work on Thursday lunchtime so I’ll not be able to meet up. My wife might be around, but with two small children to look after I doubt that she’ll fancy the Dolphin (at least not in its current incarnation).
Could you please let me know what “the successful Area Based Scheme proposal for Sydenham” is? Is it the Sydenham Society’s Sydenham Gateway? If not, can we have a look at the proposal?
Is Thursday lunchtime the only time that you’ll be in Sydenham?
Unfortunately I’ll be at work on Thursday lunchtime so I’ll not be able to meet up. My wife might be around, but with two small children to look after I doubt that she’ll fancy the Dolphin (at least not in its current incarnation).
Could you please let me know what “the successful Area Based Scheme proposal for Sydenham” is? Is it the Sydenham Society’s Sydenham Gateway? If not, can we have a look at the proposal?
Is Thursday lunchtime the only time that you’ll be in Sydenham?
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annabel mclaren
- Posts: 115
- Joined: 1 Oct 2004 19:55
- Location: thorpes
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Pat Trembath
- Posts: 613
- Joined: 2 Oct 2004 10:54
Information received by the Sydenham Society indicates that Lewisham proposes to publish its first stage consultation leaflet around the end of November. A questionnaire will seek local views regarding the high street as it is currently. The leaflet and questionnaire (to be completed by 22 December) will be circulated to 5000 households within a five minute walk of Sydenham Road and a further 5000 copies will be available in the Library and local shops so that everyone interested can take part in the process.
Concurrently, 'Living Streets' (a national charity which campaigns for better conditions for pedestrians in public places) is planning to run a series of 'Community Street Audits' in the high street. The purpose of these audits is to assess the high street's current 'walkability' and will include ‘walkabouts’ with local residents to pinpoint pedestrian problems. Space Syntax - the partnership that was employed to look at Trafalgar Square pedestrian flows before the square was pedestrianised – will also be reporting on Sydenham Road.
The results of the questionnaire will be analysed and these, together with the Living Streets and Space Syntax reports, will be subject of a dialogue to be held at two Forums during January when local residents will meet the design team, who will be then tasked with drafting proposals by April/May, which will, in turn, be the subject of a further local consultation. Following this second consultation the drafts will then be finalised and a submission for funding made to Transport for London. If accepted it is hoped that some work could start during the Financial Year beginning 2007.
Further information will be available at the Sydenham Road Regeneration Partnership meeting at the Naborhood Centre on Thursday 7 December at 7 pm. This meeting is open to all interested in the future of Sydenham
Concurrently, 'Living Streets' (a national charity which campaigns for better conditions for pedestrians in public places) is planning to run a series of 'Community Street Audits' in the high street. The purpose of these audits is to assess the high street's current 'walkability' and will include ‘walkabouts’ with local residents to pinpoint pedestrian problems. Space Syntax - the partnership that was employed to look at Trafalgar Square pedestrian flows before the square was pedestrianised – will also be reporting on Sydenham Road.
The results of the questionnaire will be analysed and these, together with the Living Streets and Space Syntax reports, will be subject of a dialogue to be held at two Forums during January when local residents will meet the design team, who will be then tasked with drafting proposals by April/May, which will, in turn, be the subject of a further local consultation. Following this second consultation the drafts will then be finalised and a submission for funding made to Transport for London. If accepted it is hoped that some work could start during the Financial Year beginning 2007.
Further information will be available at the Sydenham Road Regeneration Partnership meeting at the Naborhood Centre on Thursday 7 December at 7 pm. This meeting is open to all interested in the future of Sydenham
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castiron73
- Posts: 132
- Joined: 24 Oct 2006 10:05
- Location: Sydenham Thorpes
Going walkabout
Hello, my partner's volunteered me and our two kids for one of these walkabouts with Living Streets to discuss what we'd like to see happen in the high street.
We're keen to see trees put in. Apparently there are a lot of pipes, drains etc, which would make this difficult, but if enough people bang on about it perhaps they'll make the effort.
The plan seems to be to install black street furniture. Hopefully this means all the ugly wonky grey crash barriers will be replaced too. We think as many signs should be removed as possible, and the advertising edifice by the post office.
We find the zebra crossing by the station a bit hairy, both as pedestrians and as drivers.
Does anyone else have ideas you want us to mention?
We're keen to see trees put in. Apparently there are a lot of pipes, drains etc, which would make this difficult, but if enough people bang on about it perhaps they'll make the effort.
The plan seems to be to install black street furniture. Hopefully this means all the ugly wonky grey crash barriers will be replaced too. We think as many signs should be removed as possible, and the advertising edifice by the post office.
We find the zebra crossing by the station a bit hairy, both as pedestrians and as drivers.
Does anyone else have ideas you want us to mention?
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Pat Trembath
- Posts: 613
- Joined: 2 Oct 2004 10:54
The following is taken from the Living Streets poster advertising the street audit:
"Do you want a more pleasant high street?
Do you think Sydenham Road could be a better place to spend time?
Then tell us what you think!
COME TO A MEETING: on Wednesday 29th November at 6.00pm, at the Naborhood Centre next to the Post Office, Sydenham Road – free refreshments
COME FOR A WALK: You can join us on Sydenham Road to point out problems first-hand on Friday 1st December at 6.00pm, or on Saturday 2nd December at 12 noon, starting from the Naborhood Centre next to the Post Office.
Living Streets (formerly the Pedestrian Association) is a national charity campaigning for better streets and public spaces for people on foot.
Lewisham Council have asked us to look at Sydenham Road (from Cobbs Corner to Mayow Road, together with some neighbouring streets) from the point of view of local people. Then we can identify ways to improve your main shopping street and make it a better place to walk, talk, shop and meet friends.
Please come along and raise the issues important to you about Sydenham Road, and how it affects your quality of life.
Spaces are limited, so please contact me on 01539 738610, or 07917 312911; email me at paul.holdsworth@livingstreets.org.uk – do it now to secure your place!You can find out more about Living Streets at www.livingstreets.org.uk.
Paul Holdsworth
Living Streets"
Apart from this at the end of November 5000 questionnaire leaflets ( to be completed by 22 December ) will be delivered to residents within 5 minutes walk of the high street - another 5000 leaflets will be avialable from the Library and from various retailers in the high street.
Anyone in Sydenham interested in the future of the high street can and should take part.
"Do you want a more pleasant high street?
Do you think Sydenham Road could be a better place to spend time?
Then tell us what you think!
COME TO A MEETING: on Wednesday 29th November at 6.00pm, at the Naborhood Centre next to the Post Office, Sydenham Road – free refreshments
COME FOR A WALK: You can join us on Sydenham Road to point out problems first-hand on Friday 1st December at 6.00pm, or on Saturday 2nd December at 12 noon, starting from the Naborhood Centre next to the Post Office.
Living Streets (formerly the Pedestrian Association) is a national charity campaigning for better streets and public spaces for people on foot.
Lewisham Council have asked us to look at Sydenham Road (from Cobbs Corner to Mayow Road, together with some neighbouring streets) from the point of view of local people. Then we can identify ways to improve your main shopping street and make it a better place to walk, talk, shop and meet friends.
Please come along and raise the issues important to you about Sydenham Road, and how it affects your quality of life.
Spaces are limited, so please contact me on 01539 738610, or 07917 312911; email me at paul.holdsworth@livingstreets.org.uk – do it now to secure your place!You can find out more about Living Streets at www.livingstreets.org.uk.
Paul Holdsworth
Living Streets"
Apart from this at the end of November 5000 questionnaire leaflets ( to be completed by 22 December ) will be delivered to residents within 5 minutes walk of the high street - another 5000 leaflets will be avialable from the Library and from various retailers in the high street.
Anyone in Sydenham interested in the future of the high street can and should take part.
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castiron73
- Posts: 132
- Joined: 24 Oct 2006 10:05
- Location: Sydenham Thorpes
Apparently the planners are wondering whether to remove all crash barriers from the high street. It's well known that drivers speed up if they feel safer, so removing them should reduce speeds.
I'd guess it's a brave plan politically but I'd back it. There are various trials around and schemes that have already been implemented mixing pedestrians directly with road users by removing defined pavements and bus and cycle lanes.
This website has more
http://www.hamilton-baillie.co.uk/gallery.htm
Imagine if Sydenham could be so pioneering...
I'd guess it's a brave plan politically but I'd back it. There are various trials around and schemes that have already been implemented mixing pedestrians directly with road users by removing defined pavements and bus and cycle lanes.
This website has more
http://www.hamilton-baillie.co.uk/gallery.htm
Imagine if Sydenham could be so pioneering...
for the love of god,please NO!!!-
castiron73
- Posts: 132
- Joined: 24 Oct 2006 10:05
- Location: Sydenham Thorpes
I know it sounds mad but I think it's worth considering at least. At the moment we get drivers rushing from one set of lights to the next. In these schemes cars go slower but don't get held up so much.
I read once that to really cut road deaths all driver airbags should be replaced with a bloody great kitchen knife sticking out from the wheel.
Make drivers more nervous and pedestrians end up being safer.
I read once that to really cut road deaths all driver airbags should be replaced with a bloody great kitchen knife sticking out from the wheel.
Make drivers more nervous and pedestrians end up being safer.
the solution would be to go back to how it was before they put in all the lights and narrowed the road,it was never as bad as it is now.
i can imagine it might work[the undefined areas] in some places/countries,but not sydenham and not london at all,there are enough bad drivers who have no regard for pedestrians at the best of times,it would all end in tears!
i can imagine it might work[the undefined areas] in some places/countries,but not sydenham and not london at all,there are enough bad drivers who have no regard for pedestrians at the best of times,it would all end in tears!
Sydenaham Road Street Audit
Hi,
I cant make any of the meetings, but I think that all the shop owners should be made to move back into their shops all their wears for sale. It makes the footpaths narrow and the high street untidy and messy.
Regards
lbere
I cant make any of the meetings, but I think that all the shop owners should be made to move back into their shops all their wears for sale. It makes the footpaths narrow and the high street untidy and messy.
Regards
lbere
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still_robbo
- Posts: 46
- Joined: 24 Oct 2004 22:13
- Location: Newlands Park
I appreciate your point about the narrowing of footpaths, but I think complaining of making the street look untidy is a rather petty complaint.
I'm pleased that Sydenham high street still has a lot of independent retailers on it and it's broadly these, struggling to survive I expect, that tend to put their wares out on the street.
I'd rather they do that than go out of business and leave the high street to fill up with charity shops and the ubiquitous chains we see elsewhere.
I'm pleased that Sydenham high street still has a lot of independent retailers on it and it's broadly these, struggling to survive I expect, that tend to put their wares out on the street.
I'd rather they do that than go out of business and leave the high street to fill up with charity shops and the ubiquitous chains we see elsewhere.
Still Robbo,
I agree but try to push a double buggy on the side of the road by The Cake Shop, the shops have all their wears on the road and with people stopping to look at the goods, its a nightmare to try and get passed.
I grew up and have lived in Sydenham for 35 years and would love it to become a lovely pleasant place with a lovely high street, but I dont believe that shops that have their wears on the hight street are going to add to that.
I agree but try to push a double buggy on the side of the road by The Cake Shop, the shops have all their wears on the road and with people stopping to look at the goods, its a nightmare to try and get passed.
I grew up and have lived in Sydenham for 35 years and would love it to become a lovely pleasant place with a lovely high street, but I dont believe that shops that have their wears on the hight street are going to add to that.
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castiron73
- Posts: 132
- Joined: 24 Oct 2006 10:05
- Location: Sydenham Thorpes
How about all the shopkeepers put their wares into the road, thus reducing the speed of traffic and leaving the pavements free?
Leaf, I'm not suggesting prams should have to compete with boy racers. But if you look at the website above you'll see there are lots of schemes in London already that have removed all the ugly signs and barriers and narrowed the roads and removed road markings to slow the traffic.
We can't just say put it back to how it was because there's more traffic now, and I imagine it will only get worse when Bell Green is developed.
Anyway, this is a real opportunity to have a serious think about what we want the high street to be and the type of businesses it'll attract. For a start, Somerfield could change their store to be a Market Fresh style one when the high street gets a facelift.
Perhaps the best thing to do would be to spend the planning money on tarmacing the whole road side to side, from past Cobb's Corner down to Kent House Road, and painting simple white lines down the sides to define the pavements.
Then they could paint roundabouts (perhaps at Mayow Road, Newlands Park and Kent House Road too) and zebra crossings depending on how they are actually used, and cheaply change their mind and paint new ones if they're not working. The pavements could be wider or narrower at different sections for trial periods too.
After a year or so, when everyone's happy, do the whole thing properly with paving.
Or is that too sensible?
Leaf, I'm not suggesting prams should have to compete with boy racers. But if you look at the website above you'll see there are lots of schemes in London already that have removed all the ugly signs and barriers and narrowed the roads and removed road markings to slow the traffic.
We can't just say put it back to how it was because there's more traffic now, and I imagine it will only get worse when Bell Green is developed.
Anyway, this is a real opportunity to have a serious think about what we want the high street to be and the type of businesses it'll attract. For a start, Somerfield could change their store to be a Market Fresh style one when the high street gets a facelift.
Perhaps the best thing to do would be to spend the planning money on tarmacing the whole road side to side, from past Cobb's Corner down to Kent House Road, and painting simple white lines down the sides to define the pavements.
Then they could paint roundabouts (perhaps at Mayow Road, Newlands Park and Kent House Road too) and zebra crossings depending on how they are actually used, and cheaply change their mind and paint new ones if they're not working. The pavements could be wider or narrower at different sections for trial periods too.
After a year or so, when everyone's happy, do the whole thing properly with paving.
Or is that too sensible?
I dont think its sensible at all really,i can see why it might work in some cases,but just not in london.
Do you remember the high rd before the changes?
the way it is now just slows down traffic,so when traffic gets past those bits what does it do?.........it speeds up,all it does is moves the problem elsewhere.
If a plan like that went ahead,i would move away,seriously,i wouldnt feel safe walking with my children along a rd that was laid out like that,there are some dreadful drivers[lots unlicenced]driving around london with no idea how things work,what on earth would they make of that idea?
I dont think id hang around to find out.
Do you remember the high rd before the changes?
the way it is now just slows down traffic,so when traffic gets past those bits what does it do?.........it speeds up,all it does is moves the problem elsewhere.
If a plan like that went ahead,i would move away,seriously,i wouldnt feel safe walking with my children along a rd that was laid out like that,there are some dreadful drivers[lots unlicenced]driving around london with no idea how things work,what on earth would they make of that idea?
I dont think id hang around to find out.
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castiron73
- Posts: 132
- Joined: 24 Oct 2006 10:05
- Location: Sydenham Thorpes
You don't have to worry. People are more interested in talking about the past here than thinking about the future. If this topic had been called: 'What was Sydenham Road like just after the war?' there'd have been 300 replies on here by now.
Lewisham will put some nasty red paviers down and some black bollards, and perhaps more faux-Victorian advertising columns. It'll look like any other dying high street in the country.
Lewisham will put some nasty red paviers down and some black bollards, and perhaps more faux-Victorian advertising columns. It'll look like any other dying high street in the country.
Yes the local history topics are interesting and popular,what that has to do with my opinion that there has been far too much unnecessary change already i dont know?
Considering what this thread is about,i dont understand why you dont get my objections to something that will imo make things worse for pedestrians?
Considering what this thread is about,i dont understand why you dont get my objections to something that will imo make things worse for pedestrians?