save our front gardens

poppy · Post by **poppy** » 8 Dec 2007 08:38

Just wondered how the rest of you felt about the growing number of people who are paving over their front gardens so they can park their car in front of their house? I think if substantial planting is left either side it can look ok but some in my street are almost completely paving and look really ugly. I know parking is a problem but converting front gardens into drives often makes it worse. Whereas before, possibly, three cars could be parked outside two houses, when they have both converted their front gardens into drives only two cars can be parked, one in each drive, as often there is not enough space in between to park another car. And some, which I think are probably illegal, don't actually have enough room for their car and they hang quite a bit over the pavement.

poppy · Post by **poppy** » 8 Dec 2007 08:49

I also meant to add, that I also think they are dangerous. If you have a small child with you who runs ahead a little bit, someone could be reversing out of their drive and not see them. I know someone that this happened to. Should people really be allowed to drive accross pavements?

Wispy Wonder · Post by **Wispy Wonder** » 9 Dec 2007 18:21

I absolutely agree, cars parked on front gardens looks horrid. It certainly spoils the look of the house and can blight entire roads.

There's one road off the high street (I forget it's name) where virtually every garden has been paved over. It's an eyesore but also means no one else can park along the pavement there. Actually - that's not true, I make a point of it. These people might own the 'gardens' but they don't own the road outside. They have no right to stop anyone parking there - whether it obstructs their nasty little drives or not.

mosy · Post by **mosy** » 10 Dec 2007 11:39

Well, from what I know about this, unless an existing driveway already exisits, you're meant to get approval as you'll be driving over a pavement with services under which are meant only to carry the weight of people. A dropped kerb will cost a few hundred pounds by the way, just for dropping the kerb (not reinforcing the service pipes, whatever). I could be talking through my hat as different boroughs might have different rules.

Re ownership of the road, anyone has a right to park on it (assuming no restrictions), but there was a rule that if no dropped kerb then you had to leave space for a car to get out, but didn't have to leave space for it to get back in. Again, different boroughs probably have different rules.

Also, there is much ado that paving causes rainwater to run into drains so reduces the ground water table. Councils are trying very hard to be "green" at the moment.

This is not a definitive reply, clearly, just a couple of things you might want to look into.

Ginge · Post by **Ginge** » 10 Dec 2007 12:21

Wispy, I hope you don't park in front of people who have a dropped curb so they can't get their car out?

kennyb2 · Post by **kennyb2** » 10 Dec 2007 15:51

Bit of a nit picker, I`ve spent some time reading the road traffic acts;
No one has a "right" to park anywhere the highway.
Even when paid for its strictly a concession.
There are some quite tricky rules for what you can and cant do on the highway in the strict letter of the law,
And by the by the road trffic acts are a mine of information for those who would confound their own local authority

Wispy Wonder · Post by **Wispy Wonder** » 10 Dec 2007 17:17

Ginge

If needs must......... The road in question is the one with the car care shop on the corner. Considering that it's so close to the high street, it's ridiculous that homeowners have been allowed to highjack the parking there with their makeshift drives.

I don't park there through choice but if I must, and obstruct one of those gross paved-over gardens, it's tough.

W. Wonder

The Eagle · Post by **The Eagle** » 11 Dec 2007 05:18

What I find quite annoying is when they have the kerb lowered it stops other people parking there, then THEY (the owners) park across it knowing it is only blocking someone in their house in. So in fact they now have two reserved parking spaces, one in their front garden and the other outside where the kerb is lowered.

sarahc · Post by **sarahc** » 11 Dec 2007 14:28

Hello,

I am guilty, I'm afraid, of turning my front garden into a drive

. In my defence, I have kept shrubs and plants (AND a tree!) either side as I don't wish to lose all of the birds that visit.

I loved my front garden and was quite reluctant to convert it into a drive. My reason in doing so, was parking is a complete nightmare in my road (having 3 schools within 500 - 1000 yards of my house) and having a small child, I sometimes had to park so far away. This proved a problem when I had been shopping. What do I do? Deposit baby in house (alone) and trek back to car to lug shopping in or leave baby in car and do it the other way round????

I totally appreciate that it is ruining the appearance of some roads and having a detrimental effect on wildlife (birds love hedges etc), but I have done my best to 'compromise'. I have lots of bird feeders in my back garden as well as birdhouses etc....eases my guilt a little.

What really, really annoys me, is that some people (especially in MY road) have had their gardens converted but NOT paid to have the kerb dropped. It cost us the best part of a thousand pounds for that to be done.

I don't wish to get into an argument with anyone over this but thought I'd put my story across as 'one of those people' that have done this to their front garden.

Yes, Eagle - I now have 2 parking spaces. Sorry if that annoys you!

J Low · Post by **J Low** » 11 Dec 2007 14:34

At the end of the day, when you purchase a house you should be considering your vehicle requirements at the same time & not just destroy the nearest piece of grass at the aesthetic expense of the street. If families actually limited their needs to one or two cars max there wouldn't be such a problem in the first place - if you want a 4x4 to pick up the kids, a white van for the day job & a sports number for posing at weekends then buy a bigger property in the country!

castiron73 · Post by **castiron73** » 11 Dec 2007 14:41

sarahc there is no defence

Lots of us have children, some of us care more about the neighbourhood. Load up a buggy with shopping and baby or leave the baby in car seat or cot for five mins - it's not a crime.

There, now you can put the garden back

sarahc · Post by **sarahc** » 11 Dec 2007 14:42

Before I get 'ganged up' upon - I'd like to point out we have 1 car in our household and it is a small car.

Just to reiterate - I have kept a good third of my front garden with bushes, shrubs and a large tree.

Sarah

sarahc · Post by **sarahc** » 11 Dec 2007 14:43

I'll shut the door on my way out shall I?????

The Eagle · Post by **The Eagle** » 11 Dec 2007 15:29

sarahc wrote:Hello,

Yes, Eagle - I now have 2 parking spaces. Sorry if that annoys you!

don't you think that is wrong?

if you park across the dropped pavement shouldn't everyone else?

Ginge · Post by **Ginge** » 11 Dec 2007 16:28

But if she parks there, she is only blocking herself in so no harm done, if someone else parks there they are stopping her getting out meaning she has to wait until that fool returns before she can leave.
If someone parked across my drive (which has a lowered curb) they'd better be prepared for an earful when they return. (BTW, my drive only takes up a third of my front garden, the rest being lawn)

Jules · Post by **Jules** » 11 Dec 2007 16:29

I also have converted my front garden into a drive and no I don't feel guilty.
Opposite my little terraced house are huge Victorian houses converted into flats.
Some properties therefore have 5 or 6 cars per house. Parking was becoming impossible. Quite often my neighbours will park in front of my drive, I know where they live and if need to will ask them to move. So we're all happy.
It also reduces my car insurance being parked off road.

kster · Post by **kster** » 11 Dec 2007 16:57

It is a bit rich for the likes of Wispy Wonder to criticise people who pave over their gardens when they are the ones causing the problem in the first place. If the likes of WW used the free car park instead of parking outside people’s houses then there wouldn’t be the parking problem or the need to pave over the garden.

sarahc · Post by **sarahc** » 11 Dec 2007 18:42

Thanks for sticking up for me Ginge.

Eagle, I can park across my dropped kerb because it's MY dropped kerb. In fact, I don't - because that would be silly as I have a drive!

Don't gang up on us that have drives. Maybe we should start on people that un-necessarily drive. What about the folks of Sydenham that have big 4x4s? What about the gas guzzlers? Oohhh I could go on and go!

poppy · Post by **poppy** » 11 Dec 2007 21:02

Firstly, I don't see why any family needs more than one car unless there is someone who needs to ferry kids around in the day and the other needs to drive to work. Also, I am surprised that there have not been many comments on the safety issue. I don't see why anyone should have the 'right' to drive across the pavement

Sorry, but it also really, really saddens me that people in my road are already thinking about converting their lovely front gardens into drives because they are worried that the East London Line is going to make parking worse, and it hasn't even arrived yet! But I am glad that some of you seem to agree they are an eyesore, or have tried to make it look less so. I don't know how anyone could legislate against this, but I would if I could.

sydeman · Post by **sydeman** » 11 Dec 2007 21:44

Also, I am surprised that there have not been many comments on the safety issue. I don't see why anyone should have the 'right' to drive across the pavement

Here we go again...going on about safety issues. I know...lets put all our kids into cotton wool, lock them in their bedrooms, and not let them out incase they may actually experience the world! Yes kids, and for that matter adults, should be looked after, but i would like to know how many kids are knocked over on the roads because they don;t look or are texting, rather than by being knocked down from a driveway! I mean i was always taught when i was a kid that we should'nt cross roads where parked cars were...so presumably if the parked cars are now on the driveway, the roads are safer to cross?

I don't actually have a car, nor am i in a position to have a driveway regardless, and i am not actually a massive supporter of front gardens being turned into driveways, but i am more of a supporter of people having the right to choose about what they do with there own property! And in any case, with some imagination using the right materials, or as Sarahc says, by keeping some of the front garden, it can work.

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