KFC in Savacentre grounds?

[JRobinson]

i don't think £2 a month is enough - it's almost not worth the administration fee to set up a standing order. Why not ask for more? your website gives options of £2, £5, or £10 a month - I'm fairly sure that a lot of locals are easily earning enough to be able to afford way more than that. I'm not rich, but even £20 a month would be easily affordable for me (almost unnoticed in the greater scheme of things that get paid out once a month on DD, or SO, which you just accept go each month without thinking about it - mortgage, rent, council tax, gas, electric, water, phone bill, TV licence, etc, etc).

KFC in SavaCentre - hurrah! I love KFC (once in a while, certainly not everyday), and in my opinion it's one of the better, fried chicken establishments, and I think it will make the others nearby up their game to keep customers - a bit of local competition can only be a good thing.

[Annie]

Jrobinson, I don't think you have the right to deride the fact that some people can only afford £2.00 a month,if you wish to contribute £20.00 a month then good on you, but please leave the rest of us to pay what we can afford. Thank you.

[Rachael]

I can afford £200 a month. But things being as they are, Sydenham Youth Forum ain't gettin' a penny of it.

I'll have it, if it's going begging and you don't need it for the kennel fees.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

[Maria]

I can afford £200 a month. But things being as they are, Sydenham Youth Forum ain't gettin' a penny of it.

And what's the point of that sentence swagger? This thread had just started being constructive and positive thus the reason I came back. Go away and stay away, please - don't waste our time.

(and please don't bother telling me again that I am stupid and should never ever have come back and my posts are pathetic... because you know, the joke is on you, really. If only you knew it....)

[Annie]

Don,t answer him Maria,he might go away!

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

[Maria]

But if he doesn't, Annie, he might be sacked - which, long term, would be ever such an excellent development!

[Annie]

But if he doesn't, Annie, he might be sacked - which, long term, would be ever such an excellent development!

HeeHee

[JRobinson]

sorry if my post came across the wrong way - I'm not deriding how much others can afford, of course I understand that some people have a limited income, and £2 a month is a lot of money to them, and I'm sure SFHYF are grateful for any contribution. my post was aimed at SFHYF because this area is quite affluent, and there are probably people who can afford more.

This forum, and most other similar internet based community fora, whether we like it or not, is predominantly white middle class - if the youth forum wants people on here to donate, I think they should set the bar higher, not necessarily the lower starting bar, but definitely the highest level. as I said £2 a month for some people isn't worth the time and effort to bother to set up a standing order for.

BBW/Swagger I hope your £200+ a month savings are earning you a high interest rate, or being invested wisely to provide you with a decent pension/retirement, or a very nice holiday every year.

[admin]

A member has left STF with their posts - mostly in this thread. Quotes remain or the thread would have become unreadable. If you wish to remove quotes in your own posts - please feel free. Just hit the edit button.

Members are reminded that Town Cafe is supposed to be a friendly place. It is possible to disagree in a polite and helpful way without resorting to personal abuse.

Admin

[michael]

Swagger's contribution, apart from inciting the usual debate over his racist intentions, appears to have resulted in more income for Sydenham and Forest Hill Youth Forum, thanks to the generosity of others on this forum.

It is lovely that BBW should continue to take such an interest in the local forum, under such a variety of aliases, and the ultimate response to his nonsense is more support for community organisations that are making a positive difference for young people. If there is a lesson from the story it is that all the huffing and puffing did nothing but to give the three little pigs a better place to live. And they all lived happily ever after

[Maria]

Oh what fabulous news! Thank you admin.

By the way, now that the title of this thread no longer has any meening, and that we have started a really, really important topic, ie helping young people in Sydenham, do you all perhaps think we could/should open a brand new one with some kind of similar/relevant title?

It would be a shame to loose the momentum (spelling?) of gathering people's generosity on this....


Thoughts, folks?

[Maria]

Quoting from Rod at various points in this thread:

I'm not defending Bustard, I'm defending Swagger, and really I'm only defending what Swagger wrote"

"At worst, Swagger has taken the p*ss out of r n'b music! Not much of a crime is it?"

"Something Maria should bear in mind".

Yes, I am bearing this in mind, Rod, and thinking that your opinion therefore, does not have that much weight as opinions go.

As far as chicken is concerned, several members of this forum have said they like the KFC variety. I have not had one for ages but if it is what I think it was (does it come in cardboard boxes?) I thought it was delicious.

So, if you say my idea is a good one, going back to it: shall we open a new thread on the Forum in order to help young people in our area? (well if we do, Rod, they may even eat less chicken, see)

[Maria]

Great thanks - and fantastic that we can count you in, honestly.

Well, I was thinking more humbly about a new thread in the cafe with a title that is clearly signalling an effort to enhance the lives of Sydenham youth (and with them that of the adults, of course!); were you planning a much more prominent sub section? not sure admin would agree to that but... what do you - and others - reckon?

[Robin Orton]

Anyone can start a new thread, if they feel the existing one has gone too much off topic. I don't think Admin needs to give prior approval!

[Maria]

Sure, of course - I was referring to Rod's sentence

a new component to the Forum?

I wondered if he meant/means a distinct section of the forum (eg that of T kids) in which case admin would not perhaps find it so straightforward.

The weakness of an ordinary new thread, which as you say anyone can open, is that other people will of course gradually post on other topics and that vital one will end up disappearing from screen, hearts, and minds.

worth a thought...

[admin]

Rod,

As much as I would like to gobble up every known Sydenham niche for this Forum - would not the Sydenham & Forest Hill Youth Forum be a better home? I know they don't have a Forum in our sense but that could be fixed. Or as you suggest they could sponsor a sub-forum here.

What do you think Melissa?

Admin

[Voyageur]

A very interesting post. I've just emailed you. I agree with a lot of what you say but you are way, way too simplistic. You can't respond on a forum which, by its definition, is JUST words and criticize it for being junk. That does a disservice to everyone who contributes to a debate. You have no idea what any of the people who contribute to this forum do in reality, how they act. You don't even know their real names.

I understand that if you have read through 8 pages of splenetic discussion there is a frustration that you know the 'real' story on the ground. However, no one here has said they are trying to resolve these issues, just trying to discuss them. And as that is the very point of the forum I think it is better than nothing in a community where people often don't even speak to their next door neighbours.

And as to stereotyping - yes it often is JUST stereotyping. We stereotype Boris as...well you know.We stereotype Cameron. We stereotype the French. As MikeCg said a lot of kids grow out of it and a faux rebellious manner is an age old tradition, an age old stereotype. Another tradition is to write them off as silly kids. It seems a fair exchange.

Other than that you made some very interesting points. I'll definitely check out the website.

Have to agree with Rod's points here. Personally I find SYF's approach and comments about forum users are a bit of a turn off, even if I can applaud what she is trying to do in the area. I am sure she will find support from many though.

[Maria]

Sounds brilliant to me. And there could be other spin offs as some of the ideas Melissa mentioned.


I wonder if we should now hear from her so we take her lead, do you think? Very exciting though...

[sfhyouthforum]

Yes Admin, I think this is an amazing idea. I know there will be a lot of split opinions but often the goals are the same - reduce crime, make communities safer, put more on for the young, include older generations to reconnect with youth and so on.

Like Mayow Park, there is always some common ground for us all to enjoy.

You can't respond on a forum which, by its definition, is JUST words and criticize it for being junk. That does a disservice to everyone who contributes to a debate. You have no idea what any of the people who contribute to this forum do in reality, how they act. You don't even know their real names.

I'm sure I can criticise the inadequacy, and in some case blatantly rude, words as junk without taking away the strengths of the forum. This is about manners. We wouldn't debate this way in person because we know it is rude. The disconnect via a computer does not, and should not, reduce our manners to each other.

And as that is the very point of the forum I think it is better than nothing in a community where people often don't even speak to their next door neighbours.

Again, I wouldn't speak to my neighbours EVER if they spoke to me as some posts have spoken to Marie for example. I don't even know Marie, have never met her, but am defending her as a neighbour because this is the right thing to do.

And as to stereotyping - yes it often is JUST stereotyping. We stereotype Boris as...well you know. We stereotype Cameron. We stereotype the French. As MikeCg said a lot of kids grow out of it and a faux rebellious manner is an age old tradition, an age old stereotype. Another tradition is to write them off as silly kids. It seems a fair exchange

Again I very much disagree. Stereotyping is powerful tool that helps maintain groups in their pigeon holes. Whether it be laughing at Boris for being a posh floppy-haired fool and yet who sits with the keys of London and our banking system in his hands? So who is the loser? Us.

Or stereotyping youth, especially young black males who are often invisible as anything other that what was portrayed in the channel 4 television series Top Boy - a drug dealing thug who has no other choice than to be criminal. If every young black male was like that, believe me, Britain would have a real shock.

The truth is young people are held down by stereotypes because people do believe in them; stereotypes shape how we view, and therefore, interact with certain groups. We fear hooded youths and feel we cannot engage them. The reality is unlike Boris, these young people are extremely powerLESS. This is certainly not an exchange. They are not on here defending their honour. They are not sat around our tables while (and I certainly speak for myself) indulge in a bit of red wine socialism. They are poor, poorly housed, poorly educated, and in some cases poorly parented. Skin colour becomes an added issue because some think stereotyping is not dangerous, but it is. For all ends of the socio-economic spectrum.

So let's get out more. I challenge us all next time we pop to grab a newspaper or bottle of merlot, to have a quick chat to the boy hanging outside. Also we need volunteers to do tasks that don't involve scary youth or leaving the house. Perhaps some of you would like to help me get more organisations up on our website? Or joining our management committee and stregthening us as an organisation. To make things easy, I make sure that volunteers are given tasks that have no fixed deadlines or that do depending on your preferences, and that timewise a volunteer can do 2 hours a month. We will need people to flyer their street (one way to meet the neighbours) and advertise our website as a resource for parents and carers or grandparents with cildren or teens that come to visit the area.

My thing about £2 or 2 hours is to show that many hands make light work. Of course I would love peopel to give what they like. We have a standing order form on the website you can fill out or our details are on our guide below. We don't take or store your bank details. We give ours and make it your decision.

Here's a link about us for those more interested: https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B7tTKb ... E05eWJ3YUE

[sfhyouthforum]

I'm not being patronising by expecting better conduct from people. Just because the nature of this is online doesn't mean we shouldn't speak with politeness and aside from politeness, we should think about our words and their meaning. Like the term 'if you haven't got anything nice to say, don't [type] at all'.

And you're right it would not be impossible for some young people to come on here defending themselves but take it from someone who has worked on building youth forums with youth, this style of discussion is exclusive: Not only can this be seen as adultcentric but it also requires some literacy skills and confidence to debate. Getting more of a young online precense here would be amazing, however, I showed this to some young people they would probably say, 'this lot are worse than us' and if I were a young person reading this, I would feel saddened that adults thought of us this way. A tear might even fall into my fried chicken box.

I think the figures on low attainment speak for themselves. The voter turnout is a sad indication that some adults do not feel represented, but it doesn't mean all people who do not vote do not care or are not active.

The use of young people on social networks and facebook joining political campaigns and those who join political groups such as The Sydenham & Forest Hill Youth Forum and Lewisham Young Advisors (the voter turnout for young people in Lewisham Young Mayor elections was 43% when I last researched it) show young people are active. The Vote 16 Coalition are a mixed group of politicians and campaigners trying to get the vote lowered to 16. "When an amendment to lower the voting age was put (ironically) to the vote of politicians over a decade ago in 1999, the amendment was defeated by 434 votes to 36" (http://www.if.org.uk/archives/1889/vote ... he-problem). It is often adults that are the biggest barriers to young people's growth and it begins with an opinion. Why did so many politicians collapse the campaign? Their opinions on the ability of young people were low and if stereotyping wasn't an issue, I'd eat dog poo (again) .

I'd lastly like to add I really don't think Asian when you say corner shop, I thought of the empty corner shop that was in Sydenham for months before Coop funeral care moved in.