Antic pubs have withdrawn from the Greyhound

Sydenhamite · Post by **Sydenhamite** » 23 Feb 2012 10:10

This is such a disappointment. How has this happended at such a late stage, it beggars belief.......?

Fi Collett sent this email this morning:

From: Fi Collett [mailto:fi@antic-ltd.com]
Sent: 23 February 2012 09:47
To: Fi Collett
Subject: Greyhound - Sydenham

Dear All
It is with much sadness that I have to announce that we will not now be taking over the Greyhound in Sydenham. As many of you will have seen it has been seriously reduced in size and it is now quite simply, too small for us and all that we hope to bring to your new pub. We are currently in negotiations over another property nearby which should be finalised by the end of March, at which point I will of course be at liberty to let you know which one it is. All being well, we hope to have this new venture open in late May / early June.
In the meantime, The Sylvan Post in Forest Hill is due to open this coming Tuesday 28th at 6pm and I would like to invite you all down to have a look at the latest addition to the Antic Collective.
Thank you for your patience,
Cheers
Fi

Whiftoff · Post by **Whiftoff** » 23 Feb 2012 10:23

Hopefully they'll open un in the Two Halfs site. Also hope the Greyhound building is put to good use. Acorn had it adveritsed as a potential site for a bookies. That would be rubbish.

Sydenhamite · Post by **Sydenhamite** » 23 Feb 2012 10:30

That would be total rubbish - what can be done about this? How many bookies do we actually need?

Whiftoff · Post by **Whiftoff** » 23 Feb 2012 10:46

With a bit of luck we'll end up with two exciting new addition's. Antic in the Two Halfs site and another pub/restaurant in the Greyhound!

Marathon · Post by **Marathon** » 23 Feb 2012 10:55

Such a shame after all the hype over the last couple of years.

Still look on the bright side there's an opportunity fora nail bar or hairdressers.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

ALIB · Post by **ALIB** » 23 Feb 2012 11:48

This is very very poor.
Antic must have seen the plans and model , as most local residents have.

Although, I have to say a lot of people have mentioned that the new flats encrouch on the former pub far more than they had previously been led to believe.

Conspiracy Theory anyone ?

JulietP · Post by **JulietP** » 23 Feb 2012 11:55

I wonder what the other site is. 2 Halfs is an obvious possibility. Or perhaps the Woodman (but nowhere near as well located...)?

Jellybean · Post by **Jellybean** » 23 Feb 2012 11:59

Not good at all would have been good to have a pub there lets hope the site will be put to good use!!!

marymck · Post by **marymck** » 23 Feb 2012 12:08

However sad this is for The Greyhound, I reall hope Antix will consider taking over The Woodman. Though we have other pubs in this area, there's still a gap in the market for a friendly pub with good food and good wine and good beer, with no big screen TV. The flat above The Woodman is currently advertised to let. I'm sure it could be converted to supply guest rooms - something we're desperately short of in Sydenham/Forest Hill. It's a great location for transport and in a prominent position.

With a nice little garden at the back, space for tables (as we used to have) at the front, and catering facilities already present (unless Wooster & Stock have ripped them out already) this could make a really attractive prospect.

Weeble · Post by **Weeble** » 23 Feb 2012 13:04

This is really bad news. It's not just an issue of whether we need a decent pub in the area, but what is to happen with this important building on such a central site.

The whole redevelopment has been centred on saving the Greyhound building, and making this a focus point. If Antic don't think they can make it work as a pub, it raises the question of whether anybody else would be able to do so. The idea of it becoming a bookies makes me want to cry.

Very sad.

ALIB · Post by **ALIB** » 23 Feb 2012 14:22

The Woodman is sold to Wooster and Stock. End of.

This opens loads of questions:
Why didn't Antic conduct a proper survey of the Greyhound building until now ?
Antic must have known of the proposals for the rest of the site ?

What alternative plans do the developers have for the Greyhound. ?

I apologise for sounding slightly cynical, but this is how I feel. Really let down.

Sydenhamite · Post by **Sydenhamite** » 23 Feb 2012 16:22

I would like to hear Chris Best's view on this to be honest. It feels like there are loads of great 'plans' for improvements but then they don't happen, get delayed, get wrapped up in red tape. Can we get anything positive to happen in the area. I have to say that this is the issue that has prompted me to register on this forum (although I read it everyday) and say my piece. How can we get someone / anyone of influence to champion this cause and get something good in that space?

G-Man · Post by **G-Man** » 23 Feb 2012 16:55

I only emailed Fi yesterday, she told me that the Greyhound wouldn't be open for sometime, sounds like they had just made a decision but not gone public. I guess the development is slightly different to what it was. I just hope for all the campaigning that took place it remains a pub. How can we keep it this way? I suggest as a Forum we need to keep an eye on any planning/ license applications and react if something negative is asked for, including tweeting and getting it out to our networks. I am happy to alert CAMRA of its availability?

Sydenhamite, might be worth chatting to Leenewman, and a few others. I've had enough now and am up for getting involved if I can.

G-Man

maverick · Post by **maverick** » 23 Feb 2012 17:53

Perhaps they have chickened out,seeing that pubs are closing everywhere.You would have to be very brave indeed to even consider it. Could you rely on the local community to put enough cash over the bar,to make it a viable business?????????

Voyageur · Post by **Voyageur** » 23 Feb 2012 18:36

maverick wrote:Perhaps they have chickened out,seeing that pubs are closing everywhere.You would have to be very brave indeed to even consider it. Could you rely on the local community to put enough cash over the bar,to make it a viable business?????????

Depends how much the locals want the pub, plus who they are aiming their business at. Two old style pubs (Hollybush and Alma) closed over the last year or so up the hill in Crystal Palace but have re-opened as the Sparrowhawk and ..... wait for it..... The Alma. Both are significantly different in decor and ambience to their predecessors and are more attractive to the ubiquitous 'young professionals' that are flooding the area. Some of the locals can't bear the change in the pubs, others (like me!) love the new places. Both are doing well, unlike their predecessors.

multisync · Post by **multisync** » 23 Feb 2012 19:02

Maybe they think we could do with another funeral directors. For godsake we need something decent in the "Greyhound" area.Afterall it's the entrance to Sydenham!!!!!!

maverick · Post by **maverick** » 23 Feb 2012 19:04

Interesting,fair point.

JulietP · Post by **JulietP** » 23 Feb 2012 19:13

Voyageur wrote:
maverick wrote:Perhaps they have chickened out,seeing that pubs are closing everywhere.You would have to be very brave indeed to even consider it. Could you rely on the local community to put enough cash over the bar,to make it a viable business?????????
Depends how much the locals want the pub, plus who they are aiming their business at. Two old style pubs (Hollybush and Alma) closed over the last year or so up the hill in Crystal Palace but have re-opened as the Sparrowhawk and ..... wait for it..... The Alma. Both are significantly different in decor and ambience to their predecessors and are more attractive to the ubiquitous 'young professionals' that are flooding the area. Some of the locals can't bear the change in the pubs, others (like me!) love the new places. Both are doing well, unlike their predecessors.

Don't knock us "young professionals" too much! I think inevitably we're the future of this area.

And all I want is a decent pub for a drink and some food without having to go all the way down to the Dolphin or to Forest Hill!

biscuitman1978 · Post by **biscuitman1978** » 23 Feb 2012 19:14

maverick wrote:Perhaps they have chickened out,seeing that pubs are closing everywhere.You would have to be very brave indeed to even consider it. Could you rely on the local community to put enough cash over the bar,to make it a viable business?????????

I'm not sure that's right, given that the email from Antic very clearly says they are 'currently in negotiations over another property nearby which should be finalised by the end of March'.

PS Welcome to the Forum, maverick!

G-Man wrote:I just hope for all the campaigning that took place it remains a pub. How can we keep it this way?

The planning permission (ref LE/240/315/TP) was for: 'The partial demolition of The Greyhound Public House, 309-315 Kirkdale SE26 and full restoration to create a self-contained, Use Class A3/A4 unit in the centre of a new public square,' as well as for the L-shaped block on the former car park.

A3 is restaurants, snack bars and cafes; A4 is is pubs and bars. However, although the permission specifies A3 and A4 use, change of use from A3 and A4 uses to A1 and A2 is permitted, as you can see from the final column of the guide at http://www.cbre.co.uk/emea_en/services/ ... 10_v04.pdf, unless the planning permission specifically removes that right (and in this case it doesn't).

In theory you could ask the Council to impose an 'Article 4 direction' which would remove the right to change the pub building from A3/A4 to A1 or A2, but these directions are only used in exceptional circumstances.

If people are keen to see the building used as a pub, I suggest getting in touch with all the pub operators you can think of who might be interested in taking it on. Those operators might also conclude that it's too small, but it's worth asking. If you want Antic-style pubs, why not approach the likes of Geronimo Inns, as well as those people who currently run one or two nice pubs and might be looking to expand (in the same way the owners of the Dolphin expanded, having started with the Dartmouth Arms in Forest Hill)?

Voyageur · Post by **Voyageur** » 23 Feb 2012 19:30

JulietP wrote: Don't knock us "young professionals" too much! I think inevitably we're the future of this area.

I wasn't

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