Stanford's Maps

[Steve Grindlay]

A couple of people have expressed an interest in the Stanford's Library Maps, so I've uploaded those parts that cover the Sydenham area [here]. Viewed at "original size" they contain a surprising amount of detail and offer a vivid picture of the area nearly 150 years ago.

[Falkor]

Steve, thanks for going to all the trouble of posting those maps showing such wide coverage. Here's some observations I've made...

CATFORD

1) Wow, I didn't know there used to be all that water on the north side of Catford Bridge/Road! What is that "Waterloop" that went around Rushey Green in a semi-circle!? Is there any detailed books published on the history of Catford?
2) The Black Horse Inn and Tigers Head are both shown on the map! Anyone know why the Tigers Head was recently borded up--looks like it might be closing down!
3) Never knew there was once a police station next to the Black Horse Inn in Catford.
4) Damn, Southend Lane went through pure fields! There's only 1 single building on the bloody map!!!
5) Never knew there was an old church up Ravensbourne Road... Catford Mill looks curious... Place House and Two Brewers is on the map...

LOWER SYDENHAM

1) Bell Green Gasworks appears to be closer to where Haseltine School was built on the other side of the road?
2) Looks to be a pool of water to right of The Lawn (I read about this building in the Sydenham and Forest Hill Past book).
3) I see there's only one road coming off the bottom half of Sydenham High Street at this time, which must be Addington Grove (oldest offshoot this side?)
5) Two more ponds north of Sydenham high street (remnants of the stream?)
6) No Church Meadow houses on one side of the triangle (Westwood Hill) except one house on the corner of Jews Walk.
7) I don't see the Grove Centre House building on this map!?
Sydenham Park Road not yet joined up with Peak Hill.
9) Russell/Cheesmen Street had all houses up the North-Eastern side--now no more.
10) No Holy Trinity School yet built, but the "Market Gardens" sounds interesting...
11) I see there was a terrace of houses parallel with Dartmouth Road called Dartmouth Place. Now there's an offshoot with the same name.
12) Lot's of Croydon Canal remains.
13) Coal Depot on the other side of Forest Hill station!? Any photos exist of this??
14) No Mayow Road, but Berryman's lane footpath went right the way to Perry Vale through almost pure fields.
15) Christ Church was there in the early 1860s I see!
16) Not many buildings south side of Stanstead Road.

PENGE

1) Watermens Square was there as early as 1860s.
2) Penge Lane Tollgate!?

UPPER SYDENHAM

1) No houses yet built down Crystal Palace Park Road or South of Westwood Hill. Instead, there is the "Brickfield" with Rock cottage east of center?
2) Can't see many houses along Sydenham Hill. One appears to have a garden with a circular pathway (Woodsyre should now be about in it's place).
3) Dulwich Wood House looks be in a different place.
4) No houses yet built between Crescent Wood Road and Cox' Walk, except the one with the folly, but there were plenty on the east side.
5) Elliot Lodge is further back from the road (must be the original rear part that Steve was talking about in the other topic).
6) Lot's of buildings north side of London Road before the time of Horniman's Museum/Gardens.
7) Lot's of woodland before Hillcrest Road was laid out.

CRYSTAL PALACE

1) Grand Centre Walk didn't quite start from Thicket Road. In between is the Lower Archery Ground and one of the Engine Houses (the other one was beside the North Water Tower). Not many photos exist of this lower end of the park, and no photos exist at all of the 2 engine houses.
2) Maze hadn't yet been built on the North Mound.

Thanks again for sharing those maps, Steve! What I would really love to see would be more coverage of the 1843 Tithe Map or even earlier maps going back to the time when Sydenham Common was enclosed. Do any maps show the Croydon Canal when it was in use?

[Steve Grindlay]

Glad you found the maps useful, Falkor, and thanks for the comments. I can add a few things:

LOWER SYDENHAM
1) Bell Green Gasworks appears to be closer to where Haseltine School was built on the other side of the road?

That's right. The Sydenham Gas and Coke Company was originally on that site from about 1858. It was roughly where the scafolders' yard is today, almost opposite the Southend Lane entrance to Sainsbury's.

3) I see there's only one road coming off the bottom half of Sydenham High Street at this time, which must be Addington Grove (oldest offshoot this side?)

Apart from Berrymans Lane, of course, which is shown as a fieldpath on Rocque's map of 1745

6) No Church Meadow houses on one side of the triangle (Westwood Hill) except one house on the corner of Jews Walk.

This has to be a mistake. The houses were built, and occupied, by 1852. Sir George Grove, for example, lived in 16 Westwood Hill from October 1852 until he moved to his cottage in Lower Sydenham in 1860.

7) I don't see the Grove Centre House building on this map!?

Another mistake. Stanford's maps, although invaluable, were not surveyed with the same precision as the Ordnance Survey maps.

10) No Holy Trinity School yet built, but the "Market Gardens" sounds interesting...

They are indeed interesting (well, to me and, I suspect, to you Falkor although others' eyes may glaze over). The large field shown as "Market Gardens" was awarded to the vicar of St Mary's, Lewisham when Sydenham Common was enclosed in the early 19th century. It is also referred to as "glebe land". When the separate parishes of Sydenham (St. Barts) and Forest Hill (Christ Church) were created out of the mother parish in 1854, responsibility for this glebe land passed to the vicar of St Barts. He let it out as allotments to those who had no land of their own. When the search was on for a site for the Sydenham Recreation Ground (now called Mayow Park) this field was considered, but the vicar felt it would would be counter-productive to deprive the working man of his allotment in order to give him a sports-field. However, over time parts of the field were made available for worthy causes; a church school (opened 1874), swimming pools (1884), girl's industrial home (1890) and library (1900). Beyond these buildings the allotments survived until after the first world war when Derby Hill Crescent was laid out.

16) Not many buildings south side of Stanstead Road.

No, but surprisingly they all still survive.

UPPER SYDENHAM
3) Dulwich Wood House looks be in a different place.

Yet another mistake by the mapmaker. That is Beltwood and DWH is where it should be.

What I would really love to see would be more coverage of the 1843 Tithe Map or even earlier maps...

I'm afraid it's down to Lewisham Local Studies again. They have copies of all of these maps. You would have to seek help from a (knowledgable) member of staff, as the maps can be somewhat difficult to interpret... or PM me and I'll tell you what I can.

[Steve Grindlay]

I've put a couple of images from the tithe map [here] to give you a idea of what they contain. The plot numbers can be cross referenced in local studies, and will give you the name of the owner and tenant and the size and use of each parcel of land.

[Falkor]

Thanks Steve!

[Falkor]

A few more observations:
These Stanford maps were published 3 years before the 2nd Crystal Palace railway line was laid out in 1865; it appears that a property opposite Rockhills--with it's circular pathed garden--must have been demolished to make way for the tunnel and track.

Moving along Sydenham Hill, it seems many of the villas on the western side hadn't yet been built, and the land was still heavily wooded.

Always fascinating to look at these maps...