255-269 Sydenham Road - Planning Application

[poppy]

Sorry, haven't had time to read all the posts fully, but is this the row of buildings, which are slightly set back and where the front doors seem to come right up to the pavement?

If so, can Steve Grindley, our local historian tell us more about them?

If it is not too late could someone apply to have them listed?

[Tim Lund]

Applying for planning permission under the pious banner of "social and affordable housing" is often a false veneer. Developers will build these bland housing complex under the quite reasonable assumption that they will fail to attract reliable, lower income tenants, thus giving them an excuse to re-develop the properties to appeal to the kind of tenants who they wanted to attract all along.

I'm not doubting you for a minute - can you cite some cases?

[georgemichael]

If it is not too late could someone apply to have them listed?

Why would you want to do that?

[Dorian]

Applying for planning permission under the pious banner of "social and affordable housing" is often a false veneer. Developers will build these bland housing complex under the quite reasonable assumption that they will fail to attract reliable, lower income tenants, thus giving them an excuse to re-develop the properties to appeal to the kind of tenants who they wanted to attract all along. It's often a case of building mediocre projects simply to secure the land they're built on. When you think about it it's actually quite a reasonable arrangement. The developer has, to all intents and purposes, built affordable housing. After a period of time has passed that it's obvious that no-one's moving in, they can then apply for further permission to develop the housing complex to attract more affluent tenants. They are, after all, there to make a profit.

I too would like to sse an example of this happening BBW ?

As far as I know "Affordable Housing" is secured by a legal agreement signed by the land owner and attaches to the land if sold on. This agreement also secures the tenure of the Affordable housing and the Housing HAS to be transferred to a Registered Social Landlord, so I dont see how a private developer could do as you say, but would be keen to hear how it done ?

The three developments in Sydneham are all being carried out by a Registered Social Landlord so I dont see quite how they are going to manipulate there tennants in the way you suggest.

Interestingly the latest application subject to this OP is for 76% Social Rent and 24 % intermediate rent. So people on Lewishams priority housing list !

[Eagle]

I do not believe it is a crime to read The Daily Mail .
Would not recommend to anyone prone to depression.

[Ronski]

Out of interest does anyone have any facts about car ownership for those in this type of social housing? Other than the blandness of the design that seems to be the other issue regarding the development of the site.

thanks

[biscuitman1978]

Out of interest does anyone have any facts about car ownership for those in this type of social housing?

Appendix A of the document at http://www.communities.gov.uk/documents ... arking.pdf provides some statistics on car ownership for 'owner occupied' and 'non-owner occupied' dwellings (separately for houses and flats).

I will leave you to interrrogate the data at your leisure!

[Ronski]

thanks Biscuitman, I don't think that will really help unfortunately.

The planning document specifically mentions because its social housing car ownership will be low and there wont be any additional need for car parking. I'm curious if this is actually the case.

[biscuitman1978]

thanks Biscuitman, I don't think that will really help unfortunately.

The planning document specifically mentions because its social housing car ownership will be low and there wont be any additional need for car parking. I'm curious if this is actually the case.

'Social housing' (by which I assume you mean housing rented by its occupants from a housing assocation or local authority) is a type of 'non-owner occupier' housing.

With that in mind, if the applicant is arguing that car ownership is lower in 'social housing' than housing purchased on the open market (owner occupier), the document should give you an indication as to whether their argument is broadly fair. That said, I appreciate that the data for 'non-owner occupier' housing will probably also include the private rented sector and perhaps shared ownership (unhelpfully the authors of the report don't clearly define their terms), so it's not possible to draw any firm conclusions.

You might find research for St George (http://www.pfaplc.com/pdf/Summary_Report.pdf) more useful. Table 11 splits private dwellings from affordable, although the affordable category probably includes shared ownership as well as social rented.

I'm not aware of any more detailed research that is specific to London Borough of Lewisham, but the graph on page 3 of research (http://www.merton.gov.uk/housing/housin ... ummary.pdf) by London Borough of Merton does split out the social rented sector (council and RSL) from others.

[Dorian]

(unhelpfully the authors of the report don't clearly define their terms), so it's not possible to draw any firm conclusions.

Errrr, They do, there Design and access statement clearly states that " this scheme is 100% affordable 76% Social rent and 24% Intermediate. There are No private sale units.

[biscuitman1978]

(unhelpfully the authors of the report don't clearly define their terms), so it's not possible to draw any firm conclusions.

Errrr, They do, there Design and access statement clearly states that " this scheme is 100% affordable 76% Social rent and 24% Intermediate. There are No private sale units.

Sorry, I wasn't clear. I was referring to the CLG research (http://www.communities.gov.uk/documents ... arking.pdf) rather than any of the planning application documentation.

[140Interiors]

Sydenham is meant to be on the up. I agree the design is typical of todays bland designs where they simply fill a vacant plot. But live and let live,we dont build Victorian any more,and people do need somewhere to live. Cant do anything about the cars,perhaps go back to horse and cart, atleast then plenty organic manure.

[bigbadwolf]

Following Tim's tacit - not to mention pre-emptive - accusation of cowardice on the recent Billings thread, I've been directed to answer a question that I've been accused of avoiding. My only excuse is that I forgot about it.

Tim & Dorian, I'm also afraid to inform you that I have no online evidence to back-up my ascertions on this matter. All I can ask is you is to give me the benefit of doubt, though even I can acknowledge that that's a bit rich coming from me.

[Dorian]

Tim & Dorian, I'm also afraid to inform you that I have no online evidence to back-up my ascertions on this matter. All I can ask is you is to give me the benefit of doubt, though even I can acknowledge that that's a bit rich coming from me

Not disbeleiving you at all BBW, am just genuinely intirugued at how this has happened. Let me know where or what the development was called and I ll check it out myself.

[Tim Lund]

To repeat - I don't actually disbelieve BBW on this. It is very often right to be sceptical about people's motives, but it's better to be able to back it up with facts.

[annabel mclaren]

There will be an exhibition to view the proposals for 255-269 Sydenham Road at Sydenham Library this Thursday & Friday, from 3-8pm. This is a chance to meet the planning consultants and have your say! A flyer (with details of the proposal) has been delivered by Amicus Horizon to residents in some neighbouring roads. Please make every effort to attend and to find out more.
Annabel McLaren, Sydenham Society

[Chris Best]

Just bumping this up the list and to say that I will be visiting the library at 4pm tomorrow, Thursday, to see the plans and ask questions. I do hope that residents will be able to call in between 3 and 8pm to ask questions and provide comments.

[leenewham]

Did anyone in Fairlawn Park get a flier about this? We didn't. We will be there tomorrow.

[Search East]

Managed to pop along to the library after work tonight and talk to the planners / architects about the building plans.

It was very informative and it came across that local planning / investigations had been made a long time in advance, to consider what would be best for impact on the local area and state of the current building.

After taking everything onboard, I think it's a good step forward and can only aid to further improving Sydenham.

[Chris Best]

Those of you that objected should have received a letter to say that the local planning consultation meeting is tomorrow evening, Thursday 6 October, starting at 7.30pm and should finish by 9pm at Sydenham Community Library.

The usual format is for the applicant to present the scheme and then answer questions from the floor. This is an open meeting for anyone who wishes to raise issues and the comments are included in a report to the Planning Committee.

I will be chairing the meeting and hope to see many of you in person.