GOOD NEWS

[Savvy]

Good news. Will do.

[leenewham]

It's a great article.

This is also an interesting resource:
http://www.rudi.net/node/22243

Here are some quotes from the Government advice on healthy high streets:

"Does your town centre have enough diversity on offer to meet consumer requirements and expectations? Look out for a narrowing of the offer; has the range of shops and entertainment become more limited? Or maybe it was never broad enough in the first place."

"Pride and perception

In this case it’s not pride but lack of pride that comes before a fall.The image of a place and the perception of decline, even if unjustified, can quickly catch hold and spread. For example, a facility-poor high street that has gained itself a popular image will usually win customers away from a facility-rich one nearby that has a poor image.

It’s essential that local residents and traders take pride in their community and feel a sense of ownership. Ask yourself whether the atmosphere in your high street makes customers want to come back. Is it losing its value as a ‘brand’?

Sometimes people from outside the location are deterred by access and image problems that were solved years ago but nobody told them.You might need to market your high street more positively.Have you really looked critically at your high street at different times of the day? For example, is it a controlled, safe environment in the evening and are appropriate cleaning services in operation to ensure it is clean and tidy for visitors the next day?Consider too whether there is a wide enough range of services available, eg: catering? Can you get a cup of coffee? And, if so, is there somewhere relaxing to sit and enjoy it? This all counts towards changing a place into a destination.

It’s no longer enough for your customers to think of your high street as just ‘OK’; if that’s what they think, next time they’ll probably go elsewhere. You should aim for them to get pleasure from what they find there."

Interesting point on Pound shops, I think of them as more like Local General Stores (I'm a fan of Mustis), but they are perceived as pound shops even though they all sell lots of items that are much more than 1 pound.

Another interesting point of the BIS article was this: 'In tough times – ie: cyclical – the ‘top-end’ luxury shops and the ‘bottom-end’ value shops tend to do better, with the ones in the middle suffering most.'

This has been the case with things like value lines and Tesco Finest lines doing really well in recession. Incredibly, the fastest growing supermarket at the moment is Waitrose, the slowest growth actually the Aldi and Lidl style discounters.

[paultreacy]

I say, keep Dulwich out of Sydenham.

I would like it to be a bit safer for walking around. The driving is a bit nerve wracking at times. Been nearly run over twice just recently. The cars appeared from no where. Both times I was well into a zebra crossing.

I'd be delighted if the traffic calming measures were implemented. And a few more trees planted. We need some of those for sure.

The only thing I tend to get particular about, however, is properly brewed coffee. I hate the instant stuff. And milk. Good coffee is the only bit about gentrification I'm at all concerned about.

I rather enjoy the pound shops. Some of the proprietors are great fun. The hardware store next to the bookshop is my favorite store in Sydenham. Along with the print cartridge store. That's an excellent facility. Snappy Snaps too is rather good.

Paul Treacy
http://sydenhamshots.blogspot.com
http://paultreacy.com

[biscuitman1978]

Biscuitman1978

That's very interesting. Any chance of meeting up and sharing some of your evident knowledge / expertise? I'll pm you with some possible times

Please do. Happy to help if I can.

[Dot]

So it seems that the pound shops are a welcome presence in the High St. Their survival is partly thanks to the patronage of the value-conscious middle classes who need to save money where they can in order to afford gnocchi gratin at the Dolphin. It's proof that Sydenham is a cosmpolitain and integrated metropolis and truly a rich man's Catford. I just hope that when the High St. is finally pedestrianised that this does not create a physical distinction between the 2 parts, with pound shops on one side and 99p shops on the other.

As a shining example of a safer, healthier and more vibrant community, maybe Sydenham should be re-named Poundbury?

[digime2007]

I've nothing against them but we don't have any pound shops Dot.

[Savvy]

... my challenge is going well. I bought not only a book from the bookshop yesterday but also some very nice (though expensive) room fragrance for friend Lesley ... I made up for that this evening though by acquiring the rest of her present from the 'pound' shop - a pair of ladies slippers for... £1.99. If I get slippers for all the members of my family I'll be able to afford that hand-fed organic turkey.
The best thing about this is that I'm just getting everything on the way home, stress free and with real personal service. The worst thing is that there isn't a cocktail lounge in the bookshop like there is in Waterstones Picadilli. I miss that - last year it took me two goes before I actually bought any books.

[Tim Lund]

Come on Dot

Your posts are fun, but you don't have to see everything in terms of social class. It's as big a hang up as people who try to pretend class is irrelevant. And Sydenham Road is not going to be pedestrianised!

[Julsb]

What an interesting error regarding the supposed "pedestrianisation" of the high street. Given the passionate misinformation campaign that was launched against the high street improvements, I think I can take Dot's concerns over gentrification with an Atlantic-sized grain of salt.

[mosy]

Without having read prophetic reports about high streets, surely people realise that they were originally intended for locals and still are? Shops survive from repeat footfall rather than occasional non-local visitors, including restaurants.

I'm going to play the loyalty card here: The "buy Xmas gifts in Sydenham shops" idea is excellent and is most certainly feasible for many gifts, but it is singularly depressing that it is seen as an experiment and potentially implies that custom to shops after Xmas will revert to elsewhere for the other eleven months. One month out of 12's profit is probably a bit more seasonally limited than most local shops could survive on so where is "your" (whoever "your" is) trade going for the rest of the year?

I applaud that the council (or whoever "The Powers That Be" given traffic route) allow/provide parking. Nowt worse than passing a shop that you want to come back to, but don't as can't see (take in) whilst driving past, where to park, whilst noting myriad road signs/instructions. I think reduced signage and reduction of street furniture generally is supposed to be within the revamp, yes?

Not forgetting that many simply don't have cars anyway, plus have you seen insurance costs lately? So foreseeably more future local footfall methinks on local high street. It's fine looking above from a helicopter but it's people on the ground who spend their money.

[Tim Lund]

Mosy

I'm not quite sure what you're getting at. Is it that experimenting with buying Xmas gifts in Sydenham shops is a meaningless gesture that will not keep Sydenham Road viable throughout the year? Well, in itself it's not going to make a big difference, although any extra trade should be welcome. But it has the potential to be more than this, if we can learn from Savvy's experience. On the one hand, there will be shops where she manages to buy things she - and others who learn about it - would never have realised could be got here. This information will be of value to other local shoppers - and even more to traders who might think about how to tell local shoppers more effectively of their wares. On the other hand, there will be things she just can't get - which may be of value to traders who could then think to supply them.

I think most people would agree with what you say about street clutter and signage - and this is exactly what the Sydenham Road improvements are about. As to the different needs of people with and without cars - well, Sydenham Road will always have an advantage vs. the Savacentre, say, for people without cars (such as me), and as people without cars tend to be less well off, it will always have businesses catering to this this poorer demographic. Such businesses will include our general stores - misleadingly referred to as pound shops - but such shops will do well to let shoppers from all demographics know of the value they offer.

Sydenham Road also has another largely unexploited competitive advantage vs. the Savacentre in its location; every morning and evening, large numbers of the relatively affluent - those with jobs in the centre - walk to and from the station, and every shop front they pass is an opportunity to tell them, every day and night, what could be on offer.

[mosy]

@ Tim Lund:

First off, "depressing" is that it's an experiment seemingly just thought of rather than being the first thing thought of, i.e. "What can I buy locally before I travel further afield?". I always see what's in the High Street before going further for gifts. Gifts I receive are often compound "this that and the other" rather than single items incidentally, as are those I give, and local shops sure offer a far easier "shopping experience" than crowded department stores and associated car parks.

I just hope that people having established what's available in local shops generally during their Xmas gift search will continue to buy other goods locally all year round. For the record, you used the word "meaingless", I certainly didn't nor would have being the opposite of what I hope will come from such an experiment.

Some comments you make about maximising sales emphasises a view I made elsewhere that window displays at eye level/car level are so important, though that is one for shop owners of course.

[leenewham]

window displays at eye level/car level are so important, though that is one for shop owners of course.

Totally agree Mosy.

[parker]

As to the different needs of people with and without cars - well, Sydenham Road will always have an advantage vs. the Savacentre, say, for people without cars (such as me), and as people without cars tend to be less well off, it will always have businesses catering to this this poorer demographic. Such businesses will include our general stores - misleadingly referred to as pound shops - but such shops will do well to let shoppers from all demographics know of the value they offer.

To be honest even those in the poorer demographic can be in Lewisham Shopping Centre 20 minutes away on the 75, i cannot see how some Sydenham shops have a chance, whether we do not drive and it be on our doorstep or not, the 'poundshops' or 'general stores' can hardly compete on quality, selection and value with the likes of Primark, Argos, TKMaxx, 99p stores and Poundland especially when you can buy probably every single thing you could possibly need for Christmas in one shopping trip in Lewisham anyway. (the 'poundshops' in SYdneham arent even pound shops for a start!)

Sydenhamites can even walk to Penge and get far more in Wilkinson alone than you could possibly get in the whole of Sydenham high street. IMO Sydenham needs to buck up its ideas and attract some bigger names or atleast have shops that make you want to step inside like in Dulwich.

[leenewham]

Look like they have started work at the HSBC. Apparently it's going to be an up market estate agents. Which is a shame. It would have been great to have another different restaurant there to take advantage of the proposed pocket park. But it's been empty for years...

[jonekt]

I heard in one of the shops today it was going to be a pizza express? Does anyone know if this is true?

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

[scarpetta]

Having a Pizza Express on Sydenham Road would be welcome news but I can't see any planning applications! Planning permission was recently granted for flats in the very same building, however no mentioning about the ground floor.

[leenewham]

I doubt it would be a pizza express, they would have to apply for change of usage and there has been not talk of it at all. I heard it was going to be these guys: http://www.pedderproperty.com/

[Savvy]

I'm going to play the loyalty card here: The "buy Xmas gifts in Sydenham shops" idea is excellent and is most certainly feasible for many gifts, but it is singularly depressing that it is seen as an experiment and potentially implies that custom to shops after Xmas will revert to elsewhere for the other eleven months. One month out of 12's profit is probably a bit more seasonally limited than most local shops could survive on so where is "your" (whoever "your" is) trade going for the rest of the year?
Not forgetting that many simply don't have cars anyway, plus have you seen insurance costs lately? So foreseeably more future local footfall methinks on local high street. It's fine looking above from a helicopter but it's people on the ground who spend their money.

The reason that my Christmas Shopping in the high street is a one off is because Christmas comes but once a year!
During the rest of the year we do buy 90% of our fruit veg and 100% of our fish and meat in the highstreet, prefferably from independent shops but sometimes from the co-op.
I have never done my Christmas shopping in the high street before so that is a new thing - but it continues to go well. Next on the list is fags and booze for the outlaws.... I'll use one of the off-licences for that.

[vocal]

This may well be covered elsewhere, so apologies if so.. Has anyone noticed how Crystal Palace has changed in just the past few months? So MANY interesting, small independent retailers appear to have arrived from nowhere creating that all important "critical mass". It was a great destination treat on Sunday - browsing all the new shops, drinking and eating in one of the new cafes, visiting the marketplace (ok that may just be a one off visit - most stalls in there were uninspiring), and going to the artists workshop open day.. So, if Crystal Palace can finally be a place to spend some time, why not Sydenham??? I know, I know.. lots of threads elsewhere covering a similar theme but for once I really felt optimistic that change for the better is really possible...