Consultation on Proposal to Close Silverdale/Bishopsthorpe Road to traffic

[Ghlpc]

The queue of cars on Mayow Road to turn onto the High Street today was past the entrance to Mayow Park.

Cars now U turn and cut through Dacres Road. Right past a School.

Such a clever, well thought out proposal.

[Sydenham Syd]

I take it you’re being sarcastic and if so I totally agree.
I’m all for getting people walking and cycling etc, but I counted 44 idling cars waiting for the lights on Mayow Rd this evening as I walked up...I’ve got a funny feeling that the pollution built up there alone makes a mockery of the idea.
It’s just daft

[Holaquease]

Not sure how wise it is to revive this thread but wanted to say how grateful I am for this LTN now that we're back in lockdown. I'm clinically vulnerable and no longer feel able to use Mayow Park as it's too busy with too little attention paid to distancing. Bishops Thorpe and Silverdale provide a quiet alternative. Traffic is now reduced to the point that its possible to walk on the road if the pavement is occupied.

[stuart]

Plus me. Cycling to Forest Hill is now a pleasure - unlike the time I felt so unsafe that I did the same journey by car. Isn't that the point even if many have yet to get the message?

Sure LTNs are imperfect but that queue of 44 vehicles must give time for the occupants to consider if there is not a better way - and not just thinking Dacres Road. People will, on the whole, take the most convenient mode. Shifting the balance from one mode to another is surely the best way. If you are against LTNs enabling this then please don't oppose without coming up with a better suggestion. Unless you want to propogate the pre-Covid status quo that was literally killing us.

Stuart

[Holaquease]

Perhaps there's more support than we realise, Stuart.

https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/e ... harge-toll

[perryman]

Sorry for the bump, but are these closures still in effect?
The road closed signage is still on the planter boxes on bishopsthorpe, but the central pole seems always to be down.
Vans and cars regularly enter the road, and as a cyclist, you can't really give them that look of disapproval, as quite clearly the road is open - the council have made it so.

[syd]

LTN’s are great if you live in one those outside usually the poorer parts will see an increase in traffic. There seems to be no plan to provide an alternative to the car just displacement.

It seems like a shortsighted nimby move to benefit the already comfortable the rest of us can suffer

[Holaquease]

It seems like a shortsighted nimby move

Surely if people want to live in them it's the direct opposite of nimby.

I love the LTNs and would like to see a lot more.

[perryman]

I take then that rather being a short term trial measure, that these restrictions now are permanent.
And they are more of a width restriction/contra flow than a closed road.

I think I'm fine with that but conditioning drivers to ignore road orders, especially one telling us that a road is closed, is very irresponsible. If is is a width restriction, that's what the signs should say.

[coll]

It has been said before but nothing seems to be being done about it. There is a guy who lives in the flats at the end of Bishopsthorpe who seems to be in the business of fixing cars. He was ordered to remove the vehicles several years ago. Now he's taken the opportunity to dump at least 10 cars and vans, a trailer and rubbish at the now closed road. Its a mess there and sad that it continues without any seeming intervention.

[Joe_C]

LTN’s are great if you live in one those outside usually the poorer parts will see an increase in traffic. There seems to be no plan to provide an alternative to the car just displacement.

It seems like a shortsighted nimby move to benefit the already comfortable the rest of us can suffer

The lovely gentleman that runs the completely legitimate car repair shop in the flats helpfully cuts the lock of at least 3 times a week and puts the post back down

[perryman]

I'm against LTN's as the roads with the pollution and accidents are not on the leafy back roads.
Locally, it is Mayow Rd, Perry Vale/Perry Rise and Sydenham Rd that have the traffic problems and LTN's just add to this. It is these roads where the through traffic needs to be throttled.

The lock cutting seems to give the blessed the best of both worlds - a private enclave without the hassle of restricted access for their motors. The answer to this is to place a camera at the junction, and heavily fine the drivers who can't resist their shortcut.

[stuart]

I'm against LTN's as the roads with the pollution and accidents are not on the leafy back roads.

I'm strongly in favour of LTN's - particularly this one!

I don't live in the Thorpes - which I never thought of as very leafy but I did have to go to Forest Hill a lot. I did it by car because doing it by bicycle was very unpleasant and felt dangerous. The LTN transformed it. I switched back to my bicycle. That's one less car. If everyone who could switch for short journeys did the same there would be a lot less pollution and congestion in Sydenham and Mayow Roads. And folks would be fitter, happier and richer. Plus us asthmatics would breathe a little easier and die a little less often.

So on balance - while LTNs may disadvantage some - on the broader scale of things are they the way towards a better future? A beginning of 'Going Dutch'. I'm just sad that Lewisham hasn't given us a chance to have one here. Are you listening councillors?

Stuart

[Holaquease]

the roads with the pollution and accidents are not on the leafy back roads.
Locally, it is Mayow Rd, Perry Vale/Perry Rise and Sydenham Rd

Silverdale was one of these roads too.

[perryman]

Sliverdale hasn't had any recorded accidents last I checked. Look at the accident map of the area, and it is clear which roads are overloaded. And now they are more overloaded.

As for encouraging cycling in this area, a better use of funds would be to replace the iron bridge, lovely as it is, to something that is safer for pedestrians, including the 6th form children who share sites, the disabled and cyclists to cross.
The pinch points travelling east to west are caused by the railway/overground. Wouldn't it be lovely to have safe accessible route for people to get to the local shops, swimming pool and schools, away from the heavy traffic? Plus it would open up cycle routes to Wells park and Dulwich, and to the riverside walk/catford/Lewisham in the other direction, all on relatively quiet roads.

But investment like this will not happen, I've argued with the council for over 20 years just to replace the handrails they ripped off the bridge for - get this - reasons of safety! They will not spend the money, even to repair their own vandalism.

If the LTN does happen to create a safer cycle route, it was a by-product of cosying-up to the middle class neighbourhoods. And don't count on the route being that safe as the barrier has been down most this week with in the know drivers coming and going as they please past the no-entry signs.

[Holaquease]

I don't know about the accident map but I have witnessed an accident on Silverdale in the recent past, a head on collision between two cars. Plus multiple incidents of road rage and queues well past Bishops Thorpe in the mornings.

Agreed on the bridge although it will never be bike friendly.

[Clovers]

So this road barrier is just ignored? Just saw a van go through it. Is the road closure over?

[perryman]

I notice today that Lewisham council have this week removed the signs that indicated permission for cyclists to enter/exit bishopsthorpe. On the face of it, it is no-entry for everyone now.

"Healthy neighbourhoods is a programme that will change our streets to encourage people to walk and cycle rather than drive." Yet they are closing off roads for those that do cycle.

Of course cars are unaffected as the central pole is never locked in position and drivers routinely ignore the instructions. There was a mini traffic jam today as 4 cars were facing off in what has become a contraflow.

Improving road safety (only in the LTN obviously) is also meant to be one of the goals, but without the most basic maintenance of the structure, like sticking up and locking the pole, let alone repositioning the planters one of which is at a cocky angle like a drunken traffic cop, then I'd assess this road is now much more dangerous for everyone.

[JRW]

Tweet from the cycle mafia:

"More good news for Friday. Lewisham council have just confirmed that Bishopsthorpe rd & Silverdale modal filters are moving onto an experimental traffic order for next 18 months. It'll mean more quiet scenes like these.
Thanks @damienegan
https://t.co/cZNJqL7zUg https://t.co/ikOVW0kPWa"


https://twitter.com/lewicyclists/status ... GXbkg&s=19

[Sydenham]

Well at least this moves the closures to be based on more normal and standard regulations rather than the temporary emergency Covid related ones under which they were introduced - or at least that's what I understand. As always some will think these closures and restrictions to traffic are a good thing, whilst others will not.

No doubt the usual avenues of challenge are available - whatever they may be. Maybe an appeal to Grant Shapps as the Transport Minister is a possibility?