Could the Greyhound become an M&S Simply Food?

[dickp]

I'm curious - How does one have an "independent" pub? Independent of whom - the brewery, the church, the european union?

[Muddy Waters]

Sorry to be a bore.

Nothing is going to happen on the Greyhound site until there is a planning application and, better still (having gone through the planning process of a public consultation when we can all have our say about the future of this site) a planning permission.

So, on behalf of Sydenham, may I please ask for a response to the following plea?

Dear Milford Group

Please answer the question posed previously.

Are you currently in discussion with Lewisham Council about the future of this site? (We do not need details at this stage). If you are that is good news and we wish you luck in your negotiations.

If you are not then please tell us why.

Yours very sincerely

The residents of Sydenham

[Juwlz]

I'm curious - How does one have an "independent" pub? Independent of whom - the brewery, the church, the european union?

HaHa, ok so nothing is ever completely independent. Well I suppose one that's not part of a big theme pub chain is what I mean. Those ones tend to have to all look the same and I don't know how they'd keep the name 'The Greyhound' Maybe they could.
I suppose these days chains are capable of being a bit more sensitive, especially where they have to, ie. in conservation areas. There's even a 'tastefully blended in' McDonald's in hampstead! .

Now I come to think of it I could imagine The Greyhound as a lovely big pizza express. I think that would be great.

[Milfordgroup]

Dear Milford Group

Please answer the question posed previously.

Are you currently in discussion with Lewisham Council about the future of this site? (We do not need details at this stage). If you are that is good news and we wish you luck in your negotiations.

If you are not then please tell us why.

Yours very sincerely

The residents of Sydenham

Muddy Waters, are you a Ward Councilor or an elected member representing Sydenham ?

We are not currently discussing any new proposals for the site with Lewisham Council Planning Department, although , I repeat , we are currently persuing various options prior to submitting a Planning Application.

[Muddy Waters]

I am not a Ward Councillor nor an elected member representing Sydenham.

Put me down as a bit of a planning anorak (eyes glaze over when I start to pontificate) and I'm interested in what goes on in my town.

I'm really sorry to learn that no discussions are going on between Milford and Lewisham. This strikes me as extremely bad news for everyone in Sydenham as this will not be an easy site to obtain planning permission for, especially without prior consultation with the planners.

You dont say why there is no dialogue with Lewisham and you probably dont want to explain your reasons.

I am truly disappointed with your news.

[Big Ben]

Just to return to Dickp's interesting question - which sparked off this topic... now that we have heard that Somerfield is up for sale, how about lobbying M&S (or Waitrose!) re the Somerfield store - thus leaving the way open for the Greyhound to be restored to its original glory, with the possibility of a residential development in the car park.

[sophie]

I went to the Greyhound a couple of times before it was a Firkin, loads when it was a Firkin (we're talking at least 10 years ago now of course!) and then a few times post Firkin. I actually preferred it as a Firkin. Pre-Firkin I found it dingy, drab and boring although as a woman with a couple of friends or a bigger group it was less uncomfortable than going into the Railway! Firkin days were lively and fun and then post Firkin days have always been a bit odd. Each new management change brought about a period that was okay for a bit but not great and then it went back to being dull or too lively due to drugs, fights and loads of underage drinkers! This is MY experience and opinion!

I don't mind what it becomes really as long as it becomes something. I've never really considered the local residents behind the pub before as I always thought there was a big enough distance between them and noise etc, however I had forgotten about the carpark. Maybe something like a Harvester would be a good option as they are family oriented although it's probably not big enough for that type of venture.

[Big Ben]

A high quality residential scheme would help to sort out the problems associated with the car park - and would probably be helpful to the neighbours at the back and opposite. The Three Tuns in Beckenham (which was a pretty dodgy pub previously) could be a model for the developer. In that scheme the historic building has been restored (and has become a Zizi restaurant, part of the Pizza Express chain), there are flats above and a horseshoe-shaped set of traditional, brick built houses (with sash windows and wooden front doors) in the car park. My only criticism is that there is not any grass or soft landscaping - but that's a minor quibble!

[rodney]

As someone very concerned about the fate of the Greyhound, I wonder if someone from Milford could let us know what interest they have so far received from potential purchasers of the site?

Have Milford put the pub onto the market via any of the well-known estate agents who deal with public houses? These include:

Leodis:
http://www.leodiscommercial.co.uk/london_pubs.htm

and Fleurets:
http://www.fleurets.com/public-houses.asp

There are others too. If Milford are not using these estate agents, then how are they marketing it?

Could Milford also be kind enough to explain why they are apparently not interested in the option of building a block of flats in the Greyhound’s car park, and re-opening the pub?

[jackieboo]

it just means MORE traffic eventually.

[leenewham]

The traffic comes through Sydenham on the way to somewhere else, judging by how busy the shops are in the high street it doesn't stop!

I can' t believe M&S will make much difference to the traffic.

[jackieboo]

I can remember the traffic running freely - without a roundabout - at Cobbs'.

[sean]

I'd love to see a M&S on the ground floor and above there could be apartments. Think of the fantastic view you'd have from your living room. They could keep the surrounding exterior and build within it.

[simon]

Could anybody please tell me the name of the company that owned the Greyhound before Wealdfrost/Milford and rented the pub to Barter Inns? Thanks in advance.
Simon

[Pat Trembath]

The ownership of the Greyhound has been quite checkered over the past decade or so. The Firkin Brewery took over the pub from Taylor Walkers in 1996 and the pub was renamed the "Fewterer and Firkin". The Firkin Brewery then sold out to Mitchell and Butlers who were responsible for the "Arena" pub branding.

Following a lot of managerial problems with the Greyhound the Sydenham Society wrote to M&B in May 2005 expressing local concerns.

We received a letter in reply dated 27 May 2005 from M&B's Chief Executive, Tim Clarke, saying that M&B were aware of the concerns we had raised. During 2005 there was a refurbishment and there were hopes that new management would change the emphasis of the Greyhound into a more traditional family style pub. I would assume this is the period when Barter Inns took over the lease.

However Mitchell and Butler had, by then, sold part of the car park off for redevelopment. Two planning applications to Lewisham failed because of poor design. This would be about the time that other developers started gettng interested in the potential redevelopment of the whole site.

[simono]

Just to say that someone seems to have had the led of the roof and someone has broken in again this time through the sky light and the back door is open. So the building is now insecure and the roof will leak. Any heavy rain will therefore mean severedamage to the inside.

[poppy]

Don't the owners have a duty under the conservation order to protect the building and maybe be fined if it gets damaged?

[nork1]

Probably but it's not exactly in their interest so I doubt they'll be losing any sleep over it.

[MiniFox]

Is the site not on anyone's security patrol..?
It really is pretty poor to just let the building moulder...

I wasn't sad to see the last incarnation of the pub shut as it really was an embarrassment, but I wonder just how long it's going to stand there in this state until the developers do something actively about it. It cant be long now - after years of deterioration and now arson and repeated burglary - that it really is beyond rescue.

[fat_mike]

I think that's the Developer's plan, to let it get smashed up by vandals, squatted in and just basically to fall into a ruin, then the council will be forced to allow it to be bulldozed and flats built in it's place..........you don't have to be a rocket scientist to work that one out!