Failure of Local Community Police

[sydenhamsean]

15 minutes ago I approached a Community Policeman and informed him that Kente Cafe required help to deal with an incident in the shop.

The Policeman replied: "I suggest you contact the Police."

Then walked off. I followed and ask if he was going to attend the incident which was about 20 yards away from him.

His reply, "I have told you once. I suggest you contact the Police."

With every other question I posed the reply was the same: "I suggest you contact the Police."

Why do we have these people walking up and down the high street if they refuse to deal with an enquiry. He walked off in the direction of Lower Sydenham. Seems like some people just like to wear a uniform.

[marymck]

That's absolutely outrageous!

It's one thing to stand by while a child drowns ... the poor things wouldn't want to get their feet wet after all ... but the very least they could do is contact the police and stand by as a witness and possible deterrant.

Who pays for the Community Police? The mug-like Council Tax payer I suppose.

I hope everything was OK at Kentes and no one was hurt or too distressed.

[sydenhamsean]

Everyone is ok and we felt that the incident called for the Community Police rather than the mainstream Police.

A customer arrived at the cafe around 1pm and stayed for around 4 hours. When I saw him he was slumped in the chair and wasn't moving. I noticed that he was still breathing.

Kente didn't want to touch the man as he was concerned about his own safely, naturally. All Kente wanted was for the Community Police to come and deal with the situation.

Kente asked everyone in the shop to keep an eye out for the Community Police and ask them to attend his shop, this I did.

This is my first dealing with the community police and can only come away thinking that they are a waste of time but they do have a nice uniform

[Eagle]

Very sad . Not sure what to say except as Mrs May looking to trim budget this person should be first in line.

[stone-penge]

I suggest you contact the IPCC

http://www.ipcc.gov.uk/en/Pages/default.aspx


This officer needs retraining/discipling/dismissal.

[JulietP]

Excuse my ignorance, but what is the community police?

[Eagle]

They are Police except cannot arrest anybody , deal with any problem , untrained, do I need to go on.

[sydenhamsean]

They are Police except cannot arrest anybody , deal with any problem , untrained, do I need to go on.

Sorry, that should read.

They are Police except cannot arrest anybody, do anything, untrained, good at walking on and wearing a uniform.

[Voyageur]

Are you sure it was a PCSO and not a traffic warden or summat similar? Just a bit surprised if it was a PCSO - unusual behaviour.

[sydenhamsean]

Was wearing one of these

[Annie.]

I must just say I have a member of my family who is a PCSO, she is only in her 20s, but was out in the Riots last year helping the community in Lewisham,Also there are Two who walk the Sydenham beat who are extremely helpful, now I know you always get the exception to the rule, but they are not all useless. As you say the one you dealt with was.but please give the rest the recognition they deserve.

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[14BradfordRoad]

Very true Annie,
I have only had contact with a few PCSO's who have always (in my experience) been
extremely helpfull in dealing with Community Support issues such as traffic issues
outside Schools, monitoring social behaviour patterns, etc.
Their role can be quite limited and sometimes specific but I would have thought that
in the incident being discussed here that they could have at least assessed the situation
and passed relevant info to regular police officers if required.
As others have already pointed out; there will always be the exception to the rule!

My understanding is that part of their normal role is to give a visual presence within
the community and offer help with day to day community situations in this way freeing
up Police Officers to become more effective in dealing with crime and more serious
situations!

[Annie.]

Yes you are right B14, thats why I stated Normally they do a good job,hopefully the no good ones are the exception.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

[bensonby]

This sounds like a rather bizarre episode.... I am shocked that a PCSO could behave like that. Not least that if a PCSO needs a PC they have a radio that they can call for an officer directly.

Are you absolutely certain it was a PCSO? What was his shoulde number (or even a part of his shoulder number). There are, unfortunately, some security/ticket inspector/parking warden bods that seem to feel that it's appropriate to dress in a manner that is very similar to Police/PCSOs.

If you have a dealing with a PCSO (or a PC for that matter) and are not happy about it then you should always clock their shoulder number.


Finally, the whole scenario seems odd: why would a man collapsed in a chair be a police matter anyway? Surely it's a matter for the ambulance service?

[bensonby]

I suggest you contact the IPCC

http://www.ipcc.gov.uk/en/Pages/default.aspx


This officer needs retraining/discipling/dismissal.

The IPCC is not the correct port of call in this instance. They will just bat it back down to the local borough police. The appropriate course of action to make a complaint would be to ring 101 and report the details or report the details at the front counter of a police station and the matter will be dealt with by the officer's line management in the first instance. The IPCC would only get involved if you weren't happy with the way it was dealt with or if the matter was particularly serious.

[bensonby]

It's one thing to stand by while a child drowns ... the poor things wouldn't want to get their feet wet after all ...

You are referring to the incident in Manchester. That was a grossly misrepresented incident where the officers in question were found to have done nothing wrong.

[Voyageur]

It's one thing to stand by while a child drowns ... the poor things wouldn't want to get their feet wet after all ...

You are referring to the incident in Manchester. That was a grossly misrepresented incident where the officers in question were found to have done nothing wrong.

Yes, I read about what actually happened - shocking misrepresentation on behalf of the press

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[stone-penge]

I suggest you contact the IPCC

http://www.ipcc.gov.uk/en/Pages/default.aspx


This officer needs retraining/discipling/dismissal.

The IPCC is not the correct port of call in this instance. They will just bat it back down to the local borough police. The appropriate course of action to make a complaint would be to ring 101 and report the details or report the details at the front counter of a police station and the matter will be dealt with by the officer's line management in the first instance. The IPCC would only get involved if you weren't happy with the way it was dealt with or if the matter was particularly serious.

I don't think that's true at all, if you read the IPCC website you would learn that;

The IPCC can only deal with complaints about the behaviour, or conduct, of police officers and staff.

and

People who work in the police service should behave appropriately at all times. Expectations about the behaviour of both police officers and members of police staff are set out in their respective Standards of Professional Behaviour. These expectations include requirements to:

Act with honesty and integrity, fairness and impartiality
Treat members of the public and their colleagues with respect
Not abuse their powers and authority
Act in a manner that does not discredit or undermine public confidence in the police service
If you feel that someone working for the police has not met these standards, you can make a complaint

[admin]

I have been asked by the police to post this. Plese take note and, Sean, please contact Amanda so they can try get to the bottom of this curious event. I have asked the Met to respond if or when they acknowledge responsibility.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

We take all matters of neglect of duty very seriously. Local Management action is taking place with regards to this incident and following an investigation should it be found that the Police Community Support officer failed to carry out his duties misconduct procedures will be pursued.

We are keen to speak to the person who had direct contact with the Police Community Support officer mentioned in the post to help us with our investigation, please contact Police Sergeant Amanda Ritchie in charge of Sydenham Safer Neighbourhoods Team on 0208 649 3958 or email her amanda.ritchie at met.police.uk

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[admin]

The Met have confirmed that a PCSO was involved and are awaiting details of the complaint from the OP to determine what action is necessary. Can we put a hold on speculation meantimes as we would not wish to prejudice any investigation.

TIA
Admin

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