Local Train Services

[Forester]

'The quality of train services reflects the quality and effectiveness of the political representation in the area'

Discuss

PS hope everyone is enjoying the special short four-carriage trains that Southern runs at weekends. Especially convenient when the Overground is not running.

[squashst]

It would also help if the Southern short routes (e.g. running with Zone 1-4) and the Overground was all part of an overall London suburban "metro" service as then there might be more chance of of more sensible length trains when the Overground is out. As it is, I guess that Southern are not overly bothered about the LB to Victoria route.

I agree though that better / more active local MPS would help to hold feet to the fire. If the Government and Mayor are of the same political stripe will that help? I gess there is a fair chance we may may find out.

[Forester]

If the Government and Mayor are of the same political stripe will that help? I gess there is a fair chance we may may find out.

Indeed. If every councillor, MP, local Mayor, London Assembly Member, City Mayor, and from next month the National Govt is one party, then the 'other party' really can't be blamed any longer.

Another view would be that a seriously committed lively MP or local Mayor can get things done without every piece being in place to make things easy.

[sydnami]

Your question implies we're not already well served.. I'd argue that trains every 10-15 minutes into Victoria, London Bridge/Charing Cross and Canada Water/Highbury & Islington within a walkable distance of the centre of town is pretty enviable... Add back in the (forthcoming?) connection to East Croydon and the occasional Blackfriars service and I'm not sure what else we could need...

Getting more people to ditch their cars and rely on the public transport riches around them? Now THAT's a topic I wish our elected officials would do more to really champion.

[rbmartin]

Your question implies we're not already well served.. I'd argue that trains every 10-15 minutes into Victoria, London Bridge/Charing Cross and Canada Water/Highbury & Islington within a walkable distance of the centre of town is pretty enviable... Add back in the (forthcoming?) connection to East Croydon and the occasional Blackfriars service and I'm not sure what else we could need...

Getting more people to ditch their cars and rely on the public transport riches around them? Now THAT's a topic I wish our elected officials would do more to really champion.

I'd add the interchange at Whitechapel on the Overground for the Elizabeth line is another game changer. So much faster to get into the West End, Liverpool Street, Farringdon, Paddington and Heathrow than previously from Sydenham.

But we really need the direct trains to East Croydon back without having to change at Norwood Junction or having to use the tram at West Croydon.

[Forester]

Your question implies we're not already well served.. I'd argue that trains every 10-15 minutes into Victoria, London Bridge/Charing Cross ..........
Getting more people to ditch their cars and rely on the public transport riches around them? Now THAT's a topic I wish our elected officials would do more to really champion.

Those four trains an hour ........... would be great if we had them. If we could rely on four trains an hour from Victoria and London Bridge, then nights out in Central London wouldn't have the anxiety about missing the train and being stranded. If there are just two trains per hour and one gets cancelled, then you have an unviable service, and it's typically those late trains on cold wet evenings that do get cancelled (and no-one around to explain why).

If the Mayors want us to stop driving, then please provide the train services.

Yes the interchange at Whitechapel provides options, but you have to be able to get there (and back from there).

[sydnami]

Those four trains an hour ........... would be great if we had them. If we could rely on four trains an hour from Victoria and London Bridge, then nights out in Central London wouldn't have the anxiety about missing the train and being stranded.

True, that is annoying when it happens. Guess my point was that we're lucky to have Sydenham, Lower Sydenham and Penge East all so close and on separate lines, meaning it would have to be a pretty extreme circumstance (or very late) to truly get stranded.

[stuart]

Not to mention the 24/7 176 so there is never too late. It's quite speedy at night and a lot cheaper.

We generally go into town by rail and return by bus. It's a bit sad to see some of the audience scooting out early to catch their last train home.

We are just so lucky in Sydenham. Yes re-establishing an East Croydon service will be good this winter and with the Lizzie Line connection means our transport links are better than ever.

Well until the Bakerloo extension arrives just ahead of the next ice age.

[Forester]

re-establishing an East Croydon service will be good

Is that happening?

[stuart]

December apparently according to Ellie. And you can always trust Southern's word

[squashst]

I think I would wait for the details of the restoration of the service to East Croydon before getting too excited. Will it be peak time only (say 2 hrs in morning and evening Mon-Fri), or be wider. Length of trains etc. We shall see.

[Just John]

December apparently according to Ellie. And you can always trust Southern's word

The Invisible absentee MP you mean?

[Parker1970]

Not to mention the 24/7 176 so there is never too late. It's quite speedy at night and a lot cheaper.

We generally go into town by rail and return by bus. It's a bit sad to see some of the audience scooting out early to catch their last train home.

We are just so lucky in Sydenham. Yes re-establishing an East Croydon service will be good this winter and with the Lizzie Line connection means our transport links are better than ever.

Well until the Bakerloo extension arrives just ahead of the next ice age.

I always used the 176 back to Sydenham if it was past 10pm as it was more reliable and frequent than trains. Now I live in Anerley/Penge I get the N3, we have quite a few options for late night travel.

I have also used the Elizabeth line and it is very quick and if anyone has not tried it, I would recommend it. I got from Whitechapel in East London to Ealing in West London in around 20 minutes.. that would take almost around 45 mins to an hour on the district line with all the stops it makes.

[Forester]

December apparently according to Ellie. And you can always trust Southern's word

According to Ellie? Have you discussed with her - if not, do you have an authoritative source which confirms her personal involvement in a local transport issue?

[rbmartin]

I have also used the Elizabeth line and it is very quick and if anyone has not tried it, I would recommend it. I got from Whitechapel in East London to Ealing in West London in around 20 minutes.. that would take almost around 45 mins to an hour on the district line with all the stops it makes.

The Overground from Sydenham to Whitechapel is 22 minutes, add the 20 mins or so from Whitechapel to Ealing Broadway and it's a substantial time saving from here to West London.

[stuart]

December apparently according to Ellie. And you can always trust Southern's word

According to Ellie? Have you discussed with her - if not, do you have an authoritative source which confirms her personal involvement in a local transport issue?

Twitter/X reported here: viewtopic.php?t=22601

[angela53]

I don`t find Ellie`s post very clear. What exactly does restoring "peak" services mean? Does this mean trains from East Croydon through Sydenham will be rush hour only and not throughout the day?

[RJM]

I don`t find Ellie`s post very clear. What exactly does restoring "peak" services mean? Does this mean trains from East Croydon through Sydenham will be rush hour only and not throughout the day?

That is what it means, yes. If we want them more regularly then further campaigning is needed, and it wouldn't come through until next June at the very earliest - timetable change is only twice a year and is agreed months in advance so there's no way it could be any sooner than that.

[angela53]

Thank you for the explanation

[stuart]

The original twice an hour service was to Caterham. This now runs fast from East Croydon. One issue with terminating at East Croydon was platform availability (a through train takes only 2 minutes - a terminating train has maybe 10/15 mins which is fixed by the terminating availability at the other end).

East Croydon has a shortage which is why they are adding more. But that may in itself cause disruption during construction. I also gather the spaghetti junction between EC & Norwood Junction is also a bottleneck and needs to be improved.

Having said that - if they can squeeze two trains at peak they should be able to do it off-peak. Maybe it is a budget issue - AFAIR the government now pays Southern to run the service and pockets the revenue which will be less off-peak. Is that right?

Right now I tend to use the 197 to get to/from EC rather than change at NJ with its challenging narrow stairs.