Istanbul 'supermarket'

[coll]

Apologies in advance for the rant. I realise this may be petty but....

Friend came for dinner last night and asked if they could pick up anything. I suggest just a bottle of wine. Not knowing the area they went to Istanbul 'supermarket'. I usually don't go in there as I find the prices much higher than other local places.

When we opened the wine it was clear that there was something wrong. It was definitely off - tasting of vinegar.

This morning I decided to bring it back and tell them what happened. I woman at the counter was very friendly and said 'it's okay I'll talk to the manager.' She handed him the bottle, he opened it, sniffed it said 'normal' and pushed it back towards me. I said it's not normal it's actually off. He then began yelling at me saying many people bought that wine just this week and loved it. I explained again, trying to be difficult I was just saying what shall we do as it was £8 for the bottle. He then yelled 'take another but don't take that one or anything better or I will not allow it.' I said that's fine thank you. He became agitated saying 'I'm going back to the warehouse because I know there's nothing wrong with this product and you're the only one to ever say anything so why say stupid things.' Again, I said I'm not trying to cause a problem I was just seeing what we should do.

He came over and said 'there's nothing wrong with this.' I said sometimes wine goes off. When you go to restaurant that's why they have you taste the wine. He began yelling at me saying I was stupid and said stupid things and asked stupid questions. I grab a cheaper bottle off the wall asked 'is this okay I'm not trying to cause problems and clearly something is bothering you about me coming in here.' He continued to yell and said, 'Do not swear at me.' I hadn't. It only confirms what I have heard many say about the place - overpriced and rude owner/manager.

[Parker1970]

Do you recall the wine brand and variety?

Was it screw top or cork/wax cork?

It's surprising how little some of these stores know about wine. I had to explain to one why Cabernet Sauvignon (Red) should not be stored in the chiller.

[coll]

It was a screw top "Cabernet Rose" can't recall the brand.

[mosy]

If a screwtop, then arguably you were returning it because you didn't like it, which you can't do with any other food product you buy, so if the Istanbul manager replaced it, albeit with a bit of theatre, it's more than I'd expect.

"Horrible" wine is impossible to define other than by your taste. It is different from corked. I'd definitely expect fuss-free return if corked and I returned the full bottle and musty cork (which I have done occasionally but not Istanbul).

For horrible screwtop wine, I tend to mull it, so heated up with orange juice, cinnamon & cloves, sugar, lemon juice and water (each added to taste). And make a note of the label detail so I don't buy it again of course.

[coll]

I agree about not liking something vs. it being off. This wine was off. Sulphur and vinegar are not usually tastes/smells I would equate with a rose wine. I suspect the seal was not intact.

[Parker1970]

I agree about not liking something vs. it being off. This wine was off. Sulphur and vinegar are not usually tastes/smells I would equate with a rose wine. I suspect the seal was not intact.

I'm in Mosy's camp. Wine generally only spoils with a cork. It can spoil if it's not kept correctly, but they would have to store it somewhere very warm for it to get so bad. It could just be a simple case of a wine that tastes vile, though I would not expect that for an £8 bottle. I love wine, I probably drink far too much of it, but I have never tried a cabernet rosé. For rosé I generally go with a Pinot Grigio Rosé.

[prince]

I avoid the place like the plague.

[Robin Orton]

Wine generally only spoils with a cork. It can spoil if it's not kept correctly, but they would have to store it somewhere very warm for it to get so bad.

I have always believed that if a wine is not properly stoppered (that is, with its original cork/screwtop or with one of those vacuum stoppers you can buy) , it will oxidise and turn to vinegar, irrespective of the circumambient heat, within a few days. Is that not correct?

[coll]

I'm laughing as I write this (possibly crying a bit too). I decided to go to Bob's Wines tonight on my way home. I figured after the events as Istanbul I could redress the balance by giving them my business - as it should have been in the first place. I'm happy to give them my money as I think they do a great job and are really good for the area.

The man working there was very helpful in guiding me to a wine. I wanted to spend around £10. He suggested an Italian that I have had before so I chose his recommendation. It was priced on the fridge cooler as £10.45. Fine!

He rang it up and as I tapped my contactless payment he said, 'Its actually £11.25. The prices went up from the distributor.' As I was in mid-tap I said, 'So this wine marked at £10.45 is actually £11.25?' 'Yes!' I wasn't going to quibble over 80p but my jaw dropped. Seriously? It left me feeling uncomfortable. I'll still go back there but come on Bob's Wine, what is that about? Sort that FAST!

Maybe I should stick to water!

[Jollylolly]

Hi

I have worked in the wine industry for over 15 years. From high street to finer establishments, so a lot of the stuff has passed my nose (or gone down the gob!)

wine under screwcap can indeed be faulty. It can be reductive or more probably in this case oxidised (if it was like vinegar) especially if it was a cheap Stelvin closure which has let too much air in or become damaged. I doubt Istanbul has optimum storage conditions and there is s lot of warm strip lighting in there.

Shock horror but a wine under screw cap can also technically be corked/show musty aromas. Though I have only found this once or twice. Oxidisation is far more common.
This link explains it fairly well as I can't be bothered to go into it at this hour
https://beta.theglobeandmail.com/life/f ... ice=mobile

I personally would never even question a customer who brought back an 8 quid bottle and refund straight away (unless the bottle was empty/getting there!)

You should never risk your reputation for the sake of 8 quid! Similarly although BOB wines are not obliged to sell you the wine at the price shown, they should have honoured the lower price as a gesture since it was pennies here...

I have refunded bottles worth hundreds of pounds - wine is a natural product and no matter how great the quality it is prone to defects.

I live near the Big Istanbul at the lower end of Sydenham road and only go in there in emergencies such as running out of bananas (2 kids) and I will be charge about 42 quid for 6. So I try to avoid. However I have always been treated nicely and the guy even ordered in a favourite foreign fizzy drink of mine especially. So I hope it was a one off. Almost every time I have been in I have seen some pretty difficult (drunk or shouty) customers so I reckon they maybe put on a tough exterior, however I am not trying to excuse the poor customer service you received this time.

[Nigel]

Jollylolly
Yes and yes - technicalities aside I don't see how anyone can conclude that the bottle was definitely not defective .
Beyond that - what happened to " the customer is always right " ?

I doubt many of us would see PFC as a wine destination but that stupid and ignorant manager must have put off some customers for what is a paltry amount . No excuse for rudeness , ever .

I have very mixed views on the shop - handy for a large bag of cumin or big bunch of parsley but unless caught out after hours I would always get that from Fresh and Fruity - and you always get top notch service there too . I've never had cause to take so much as a carrot back there but I know if I did they wouldn't quibble .
At the end of the day many products are not wildly different to another , what marks a shop out for me is service , friendliness and knowing what they are talking about - in other words no to B and Q , yes to Sydenham DIY - at the moment PFC remains a maybe for me.

A very good evening
Nigel

[Parker1970]

Jollylolly

Beyond that - what happened to " the customer is always right " ?



A very good evening
Nigel

Not saying the bottle wasn't defective, but this phrase "The customer is always right" is a load of twaddle. Many retailers may go with "The customer comes first" but to agree the customer is always right is just daft. As evidenced on https://notalwaysright.com/

[The Clown]

No excuses though - unacceptable to treat a customer that way.

Disappointing - I read about the problems in PFC with the overcharging of some customers, which put me off shopping in there afterwards.

I'm really surprised a business owner would behave that way. Glad you posted as I do try to avoid Tesco if I can, but difficult to support a local business owner that doesn't support its local customers....

[iandavenport]

this seems to have drifted from Istanbul to PFC - I've never had any problems with PFC and chose it over the other similar store - not that i would think of it as high on my list of wine outlets

[Nigel]

Parker
It's not literal but shorthand for " don't piss off a punter for 8 poxy quid ".
Seriously I wouldn't shop with anyone that didn't give me the benefit of the doubt if I presented calmly and reasonably as Coll no doubt did .

I don't see why people are building a case for rejecting out of hand , a reasonable request for a refund .

Surely the onus is not now on the customer to prove an unpalatable chemical change has taken place ?

A very good evening
Nigel

[chrisj1948]

this seems to have drifted from Istanbul to PFC - I've never had any problems with PFC and chose it over the other similar store - not that i would think of it as high on my list of wine outlets

PFC have some very good wine offers if you are not looking for fancy wines. The 'charging problem' only happened briefly, and then the staff responsible moved on - details unknown. They are not the cheapest store generally, but they are open 24/7, which increases their costs, and their range of products is excellent. My wife & I count ourselves fortunate that they, Billings, and Fresh & Fruity all lie within 20 yards of our door!

Regards
Chris J.

[alywin]

Similarly although BOB wines are not obliged to sell you the wine at the price shown, they should have honoured the lower price as a gesture since it was pennies here...

*Aren't* they? I thought it was illegal to charge more than the marked price?

[Jollylolly]

If an item is priced incorrectly on the shelf, or scans at the wrong price at the till, retailers are under no obligation to honour it, under the Sale of Goods Act. They can offer the item at the correct price or refuse your money and withdraw the product from sale.

Obvs if it is a question of a few pence/pounds the shop may choose to honour it.

We are all human and make mistakes!

However if a sale has been completed and the money has left your hands/your bank account (and I think if you have taken away goods) then you have entered a legally binding contract and the retailer is not legally allowed to claw back the money from you.

lots of mistakes are made online with big retailers.... it's usually only those who have taken the goods away that "profit" as I think the shop can cancel the order.

As a customer I usually point out to an independent shop if they are under charging me. I wouldn't want them to get into trouble for possibly someone else's mistake.

If someone points out a BIG mistake during a transaction I am doing they get 10% off for honesty. If it is a little mistake the price is honoured. I do get annoyed at customers who think they can profit from a mistake such as 1 pound instead of 100 . Why would you want to do a local/independent business out of money? It's hard enough to compete with massive supermarkets etc WHICH IS WHY IMPECCABLE CUSTOMER SERVICE IS A MUST (getting back on topic) it's why someone might choose to make the extra journey to you. And yes the customer is not always right but they fill your pockets at the end of the day so it's best to give them the benefit of the doubt

[mosy]

.. Please ignore. I was starting to write a 99-page novel - far too many words.

[syd]

They sold me a bottle of fake smirnoff. Ive never been back