Windmill Victory

[Eagle]

Sydeham should be able to support more Pubs not less. We have lost The Duke of Edinburgh , The Talma and The Woodman in that small area .

I believe only have Fox and Hounds and Brick left .

Of course it should be a Pub or Pub / Cafe .

[parker]

Ideas about hotels, B&Bs, multi-storey pubs and roof terraces on Kirkdale all sound good but I think the plans approved by the planning committee are more likely to succeed and appeal to a business owner. I'm sure the residential units will be snapped up.

Mary as a member of the Sydenham Society planning committee can you let us know whether the Society plans to appeal the decision on behalf of the community or take any other action that might delay the development?

I think the Sydenham Society should delay it until a mini branch of Harrods wants to open there.

[Pally]

Sydeham should be able to support more Pubs not less. We have lost The Duke of Edinburgh , The Talma and The Woodman in that small area .

I believe only have Fox and Hounds and Brick left .

Of course it should be a Pub or Pub / Cafe .

Why should Sydenham be able to support more pubs?

[Eagle]

Because in the past it supported many more.

[D-W]

Link to an interesting article on the declining number of pubs in London. Looks like this isn't just a local phenomenon.

https://www.economist.com/blogs/graphic ... ly-chart-4

[mosy]

Interesting article - thanks D-W. I wonder about the cost of pub beer, especially if relying on daily or at least regular customers for more than one pint each per visit. Maybe compounded by expensive subscription TV cutting into beer money and not forgetting cheaper supermarket booze. Escalating duty/tax/VAT doesn't help either.

Article here about pub beer sales down 2.9%:
http://www.morningadvertiser.co.uk/Drin ... ed-by-BBPA

[Pally]

Because in the past it supported many more.

But its supporting other social things now ...Cafes etc. Life changes

[Pally]

Link to an interesting article on the declining number of pubs in London. Looks like this isn't just a local phenomenon.

https://www.economist.com/blogs/graphic ... ly-chart-4

It's interesting. Also interesting that for years now I've listened to people saying, almost without giving it any thought, that immigration isn't going to change the British way of life. Well the decline in pubs is partly attributable to a change in demographics. In addition, there is no clear replacement for pubs that I can see which also happens to bring local people together.

Of course if you're not a fan of pubs, or a non-drinker on religious grounds, then I'd anticipate a shrug.

I like pubs; I drink; I am non religious. But society changes, people's preferences differ and I think other things can bring community together as well as pubs!

[leenewham]

The Woodsman is now a cafe, I agree. Places like on the Hoof have great music nights. Many local businesses and cafes are involved with the Arts Festival. The Alexandra Nurseries is a great community space and I've enjoyed talking with other people there who I've never met before. The same with the Bluebell Cafe in Penge, one of the best social hubs I've ever been to, or Sugahill, or many others, like the great cafe in Mayow.

I like pubs too, but I don't think they are the only means of casting your social net to a wider audience. Pubs have always closed or changed hands. New bars are opening in other areas and while rents and prices rise, I'm sure than many pubs and other similar businesses will change. If anything, I find it easier to chat to people in cafes than pubs.

Why not classify them as social spaces? Perhaps we need to shake up planning with a special category to allow more flexibility, so pubs can become cafes etc as long as the bar remains, so in the future it can turn back into a pub.

[appletree]

I consider pubs to be mainly male spaces and therefore, as a woman, would prefer less stress on pubs when there are so many.

I would not go to a pub by myself but would go to a café or similar space.

[Eagle]

Pubs a great way for the community to meet.

There are far less pubs in Kirkdale area than in 70's or 30 's.

[JRobinson]

people now have more choice in their alcohol consumption - by that I mean that there are now many more small craft breweries, and home brew is also a large factor - if a pub is tied to one supplier, as many are, then they'll only be selling what the supplier lets them, and if that is two types of sh1tty lager, and one ale, then a lot of people won't go there. If the pub isn't tied, then they might be able to sell many more different ales on tap, and bottles, thus getting a more diverse clientele.

[appletree]

I see work is beginning on the old Windmill -- scaffolding is up.

[rustya]

any updates re the Old Windmill ?

[rustya]

Any updates on this topic ?

[sugahill cafe]

One of our customers showed us the proposed plans/images for this site so the info is out there.