Uninhibited parking Cobbs and Lawrie park rd

[mosy]

As the club is there for now at least, what about a Park and Ride bus to/from Girton Road car park? I assume Zanizibar could hire a minibus to go up and down Sydenham Road every 15 mins or so, at opening and closing time and advertise it on their fliers or via social media.

Strategically placed (i.e. highly visible) official clamping vans, clearly marked, might be a deterrent, especially if pavement signs (like the "Road works ahead" ones) are placed, but saying "Illegally parked cars WILL be clamped". I'm sure this would work (after one or two were clamped), well better than nothing anyway, but who picks up the tab if Zanzibar say it's not their job to police parking?

Just ideas to add to the pot.

[Eagle]

Mosy

I would imagine your suggestion would be treated with derision by the good owners.

You say here for some time. Surely current licence only midnight closing , or have I missed something. True midnight too late but better than before.

It is a puzzle for and me and others as to why the police and others do not want to enforce the law in the night. One always had the impression the law was a 24/7 application.

[Nigel]

Eagle
Matt McGrath and Chris Best both replied promptly . I think it is clear that they are trying to do something - I think the legal system is probably getting in the way - I am definitely more of the angry villagers with torches persuasion but I do think letting the police and Lewisham council know just how intrusive this place has become is worth doing . They can't do anything without the backing of local people - although I am luckily enough not to live near the wretched place I do see the mess and upheaval it causes , and as someone who went to the last meeting I am in no doubt about how much misery that place has caused a lot of nearby residents . I like Mosy's Park'n'Ride idea - though I would prefer the punters to be dropped off a bit further away , say just outside Rochester, to guarantee everyone a good nights sleep ( in Sydenham at least) .
It feels like time the good guys won .
A very good evening
Nigel

[mosy]

Mosy

I would imagine your suggestion would be treated with derision by the good owners.

You say here for some time. Surely current licence only midnight closing , or have I missed something. True midnight too late but better than before.

It is a puzzle for and me and others as to why the police and others do not want to enforce the law in the night. One always had the impression the law was a 24/7 application.

Well, it's not really for you to speak for the owners is it? Yes, my ideas might be flushed down the pan, but better to throw a ball in the air in case someone catches it.

Please quote me correctly. I said the club is there at least for now, although granted probably amounts to "for some time", which makes it all the more reason to find a workable solution.

I thought the licence had changed from 4pm to 2pm. Not sure where you get midnight from?

I think parking is a civil matter, i.e. council rather than police (assuming no criminal activity), so 24/7 would be the council's choice wouldn't it? I would imagine any parking attendant could be given abuse (hopefully only verbal) so I can't imagine too many volunteering to guide or contest errant parking drivers.

[Eagle]

Mosy

True not up to me to speak for the owners. Apologies.

Some of the complaints had been about double parking , is not this a Police matter.??

2pm , surely you are jesting. I thought the locals were being given an improvement.

Trouble is if the authorities wash their hands of this anti social and illegal activity , then with great regret , locals whose lives have been devastated might consider vigilante action. This has happened before with terrible results.

I sincerely hope not as this would only make matters worse.

Not sure who is responsible but Council , if they insist the place cannot be closed , should get together all parties and make sure no illegal activity takes place.

[mosy]

No jest Eagle; it went from 4am to 2am, apart from any occasional successful TENS application for an extension - unless it's changed again.

Perhaps if anyone contacts the links given by biscuitman1978 they'll post any replies which might shed light on responsibility and any preventive actions being considered. (I didn't witness the bad parking personally.)

[gillyjp]

The chaos of the other night will hopefully be used if and when they apply for any Temporary Extension Notice (TENs). I know Matt MGrath the Licensing Officer witnessed the rumpus, the illegal parking, etc first hand and I have every confidence that he will cite this to the Committee as reason for not granting a TENs in the foreseeable future.

As I said in my earlier post, if the new management cannot control a wake on a rainy midweek day, I do not hold out any hope that they will successfully keep order, peace and quiet on any weekend event. We had a post from Lee Jasper in the latter part of last year saying how it would all be different - all controlled, a more mature clientele, etc. I'm afraid they fell at the first hurdle.

Time to close this place down.

[Eagle]

I hope you are correct Gilly , however the fact they still have a license at all does not show the council in a good light.

[Gaddison]

A chap from the club came round last night to try and drum up local support for a temporary late night opening at the end of January. Needless to say I said I did not support it., and was glad to see the petition blank

[Eagle]

Gaddison

Well they have got some front.

[Gaddison]

well, it has prompted me now to email licensing and lodge my opposition to any such temporary events. I would urge others affected yo do the same

[Eagle]

Good luck with that Gaddison.

However seems the council are far more interested in promoting this dubious business rather than supporting the local people.

I wonder how many people who work in the establishment actually live within 1 mile.of it.

[leenewham]

A few ideas:
Get a council tow truck there when events are about to happen. Tow away any car parked in a place they shouldn't be parked with a realise fee of £150 after a period of 24 hours.

Charge Zanzibar for the police time and the time the tow truck is being used.

Advertise the proper places to park and instruct the people visiting they they need to park in the proper place and that walking is actually a good thing to do and nothing to be afraid of.

Suggest a policy that designated drivers do not drink for the club. Police on standby with breathalysers.

Lewisham council are pretty rubbish at sorting out these sorts of issues unfortunately, all talk and no trousers.

[stuart]

However seems the council are far more interested in promoting this dubious business rather than supporting the local people.

I am surprised you should say that. Did you not attend or notice who organised the Zanzibar Public Meetings seeking to restrain or remove usage? I can't see how you can fault our councillors on the issue. They have come out very strong.

The problem is the limited powers the council has in this area. Evidence has to be tested in court and the law prescribes what is admissible and what is not. The council has taken an active part in gathering as much evidence as they can to take the court which is why we got the licence restriction. If Zanzibar is still unable to prevent itself from becoming a public nuisance (and this event suggests they are) then we can try and push on to stop the nuisance or the club altogether.

Sniping at people who, in this instance, are trying their best is dispiriting and counter productive. If you help the cause then please do. If you can't - don't be a nuisance too.

Get a council tow truck there when events are about to happen. Tow away any car parked in a place they shouldn't be parked with a realise fee of £150 after a period of 24 hours

Getting parking enforcement is obviously a good idea. Lewisham have, like many councils, contracted this out to NSL http://www.nsl.co.uk/service-enforcement/

I do not know if this means NSL are responsible for operational control of where their operatives work and when. Or whether this is any incentive/profit to be made from 'out of hours targetting'. Maybe somebody close to the council could help us here?

Stuart

[Eagle]

Stuart

Your point about being negative to the Council taken.

I bow to your superior knowledge on this matter , but surely at some time the Council must have authorised this activity ???

I , like others , cannot understand , with overwhelming residents objections , how this establishment is still open.

[leenewham]

That's been tried hasn't it Rod?

If they continue to make lots of people who live nearby unhappy, then surely they should find more fitting premises in a suitable location to cater for their clients? It makes sense to keep this away from people who need basic things like sleep or being able to live in their home without a beacon for inconsiderate behaviour nearby.

[Lee Jasper]

From all at Zanzibar now Maestro's Arts and Education Centre, we would like to offer a formal and sincere apology to all local residents, who were unfortunately affected by a private event, held at the club on the 15th of January 2015.

The event however has to be seen in context of what happened on the night and not what people assume to have occurred, without having spoken to anyone at club . This was a Caribbean funeral wake (Nine Night), that in many respects is much like an Irish wake. We were initially advised that the expected attendance would be between 600 - 700 people. We organised our stewarding on the basis of this maximum attendance and we where therefore understaffed and largely unprepared for the 700-800 additional customers that had to be turned away on the night.

This is in total contrast to our recent efforts, for example on New Years Eve, where no complaints were received. On this occasion, we were caught off guard and were unprepared for such a large crowd. Nevertheless, the management is completely clear that what happened on this evening was not acceptable.

We have now reviewed and amended our hire conditions advising those that wish to hire the venue that there will now be a financial penalty if numbers exceed their initial estimates. In addition we have now contracted a local group of stewards, who can be called upon at short notice to supplement existing stewarding arrangements at short notice.

We have been previously instructed by Lewisham Council Licensing Committee, that we can no longer set out parking cones or parking restrictive barriers on the public highway. This had been instituted by the previous management , after local consultation and had the agreement of the Council and Lewisham Police. They're view now having changed we are unable to prevent illegal parking.

We fought hard to retain this option but were left with no choice but to remove both barriers and cones.

This new ruling clearly exacerbated the local parking problems and left our stewards with very little control on where people parked on the night itself. In the light of this we are also exploring other alternatives with Lewisham Council as suggested here, such as the provision of late night parking wardens, tow trucks to enforce last night parking restrictions.

Quite literally we were taken by surprise by this event and are now ensuring we review and put in place contingency measures to ensure the high standards achieved on New Year’s Eve are maintained as a matter of course.

I would remind some posters, that this is just but one of the many, many, event nights, that has been in anyway problematic over the last 6 months and to suggest on the basis of this isolated incident, that the Club has failed on its commitments to deliver the promises it made, we feel is unfair.

Further, whilst we have initiated radical change and have already delivered a qualitative improvement to our immediate neighbours, its important that all recognise and accept, that this a process of improvement and in the business of handling both people and events, it is inevitable, from time to time, that issues and concerns will inevitably arise.

On the call for our licence to be removed or be closed down. There has been a club in our venue for over 20 years. Calling for the club to be closed down as some have done here, hints at broader agenda than simply seeking to positively engage and resolve problems.

We will continue to strive to minimise the effect of these unintended consequences and continue to learn from these incidents and improve on our long term performance as a result.

Once again we offer you our apologies and reiterate our commitment to positive and responsive dialogue with our neighbours.

[Lee Jasper]

I would also just add, that the Club is under new management (May 2014) and to simply ascribe to the club now, all of the historic problems associated with the previous owner is simply unfair. We have demonstrated a completely different approach to these matters as anyone who had taken up our invite to come and see us at the club, and has actually seen and heard what we're doing will testify. We extend this invite to you again, come and talk to us we'd love to see you.

[stuart]

Calling for the club to be closed down as some have done hear hints at broader agenda than simply seeking to positively engage and resolve problems.

I have called for closure if the nuisance cannot be mitigated. What agenda are you hinting I may have?

Stuart

[Lee Jasper]

The new owner has owned the club for less than 6 months and on the basis of one incident, some seem very keen to shut the club down. My response is simply this, why don't you come and talk to us and see for yourself what were doing, what plans we have for the future, before simply lumping us with the terrible record of the previous owners and calling for our license to be removed?