Legible London, illegible Lewisham?

[Tim Lund]

I'm sure I'm not the only person to have seen these in our pavements



This was was just outside the Cake Shop in Mayow Road, and I saw another in the pocket park at the end of Venner Road. Naturally, I wondered what they are for, so went to the web site shown and didn't actually find out. There's an "About Legible London" page, which explains

Walking is a great way of getting around London.

As well as being free, healthy and environmentally friendly, it can also save you time - 109 journeys between neighbouring central London Underground stations are actually quicker on foot than the Tube!

Yet many people are put off by inconsistent signage and confusion about distances between areas.

We've developed Legible London to tackle these issues and help both residents and visitors walk to their destination quickly and easily..

and a gallery of sign from following a link about street furniture


but I can't see any of these plates unobtrusively set into pavements.

OK - I've already been accused of conspiracy theorising on this, but this is what I'm wondering - are these part of the "internet of things",

“HOLY cripes, Google just broke into my home”, was a typical reaction on Twitter to news on January 13th that the internet giant had splashed out $3.2 billion of its cash pile on Nest, a startup that makes smart thermostats and smoke-alarm systems for houses and apartments. The deal is striking not just because it represents a massive pay day for a hardware company that is only a few years old. It is also a landmark deal that signals the coming of age of the internet of things, or “Thingternet”—a world in which everything from household gadgets to cars, clothes and pets are connected wirelessly to the web.

Do these plates have some electronics embedded in them which will provide TfL with real time data on when people (not necessarily identifiable by name) walk past, and where they move to next, so providing the data on actual walking patterns this project must need? This is a wild guess, and I'd have thought that such data could be collected from the existing mobile phone infrastructure, but has anyone any better ideas as to what these plates are for?

[chrisj1948]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legible_London

Doesn't sound like a Big Brother scheme, and the picture you posted was of a metal plate; not normally good for concealing covert surveillance electronic sensors.

Regards
Chris

[Tim Lund]

Sure, and I'm aware of the risk of looking stupid, but what do you think these plates are for? Just on pavement signage? That hardly makes sense either.

[leenewham]

It's for a legible London sign. Either a minilith or a monolith (standing posts with maps on, they are all over London). They will show various local landmarks and places of interest (normally determined at design stage by traders groups and local cllrs).

I tried to get lewisham council to allow engraved paving slabs in Sydenham near the station pointing the way to kirkdake, sydenhams oldest high street, (to help with thier footfall as it's low) but lewisham councils highways department were unhelpful and said no,
unfortunately as he thought it would anger local traders in Sydenham by telling people where another part of Sydenham is and that we can't touch sydenhams new paving. I got lots of convoluted reasons why it's not possible to do anything from them, which is normal for lewisham.

[Tim Lund]

It's for a legible London sign. Either a minilith or a monolith (standing posts with maps on, they are all over London). They will show various local landmarks and places of interest (normally determined at design stage by traders groups and local cllrs).

I tried to get lewisham council to allow engraved paving slabs in Sydenham near the station pointing the way to kirkdake, sydenhams oldest high street, (to help with thier footfall as it's low) but lewisham councils highways department were unhelpful and said no,
unfortunately as he thought it would anger local traders in Sydenham by telling people where another part of Sydenham is and that we can't touch sydenhams new paving. I got lots of convoluted reasons why it's not possible to do anything from them, which is normal for lewisham.

So they're just an unsatisfactory compromise between TfL wanting to do something useful, and Lewisham Council highways not wanting anything? Is this something to do with Lewisham no longer actually having a head of transport? I read something about this a while back, and there's no mention of it on this organisation chart

[leenewham]

No, I think you have the wrong end of the stick Tim.

Legible LONDON is good. It's well designed and it works.

[Tim Lund]

No, I think you have the wrong end of the stick Tim.

Legible LONDON is good. It's well designed and it works.

You misunderstand me - I have never thought Legible London anything other than good. It feels like one more way in which better design can help us, and I've long thought TfL is basically a good thing. That's why I was puzzled by these odd plates, whose value I can't understand - unlike the miniliths and monoliths you mention that I have seen elsewhere in London.

What you have here, before your very eyes, is evidence of me making a conjecture and putting it forward for possible refutation, and as a result of your gratefully acknowledged refutation, having learned something. Now I'd like to know who that person was in Lewisham council's highways department who said no, and why he thought that it would anger local traders in Sydenham. How were they consulted?

What about the rest of Lewisham? Is it a case of Legible London, but illegible Lewisham?

[Rachael]

It's for a legible London sign. Either a minilith or a monolith (standing posts with maps on, they are all over London). They will show various local landmarks and places of interest (normally determined at design stage by traders groups and local cllrs).

I'm a bit confused. Are these metal plates placeholders for Legible London signs still to come?

[leenewham]

Yes, they are placeholders for the legible London signs.

I'm not sure what you are saying Tim. The plates will be replaced with a legible London sign. I thought that was fairly obvious

[Tim Lund]

Yes, they are placeholders for the legible London signs.

I'm not sure what you are saying Tim. The plates will be replaced with a legible London sign. I thought that was fairly obvious

Sorry - not obvious enough for me Yes - I should have read what you wrote more carefully. Somehow I thought you were saying that the Legible London maps would not be coming. Do you know when they will be?

[leenewham]

My guess is about a month or two. They took a while to appear in ruislip where I worked in North London.