Sydenham Road traffic

[Monica]

Whether you are a driver, a pedestrian, or a business on Sydenham Road, the current state is unpleasant and bad for all in my view. I agree that re-examining the phasing of the lights at Mayow/Sydenham Road corner and the crossing outsidthe bookshop might help things flow a lot better and I will be urging the relevant bods to look into this. The traffic has always been congested at peak times in this area. Now it is congested - and more so than in the 10 years I have lived here - for much longer periods of the day. It would seem to me that there aren't suddenly masses more drivers using the road, but that the new traffic conditions are having a negative effect on congestion. Yes, it would be lovely to live in a London where a lot fewer people drove everywhere, but until that wonderful, utopian day, I guess we'll have a smoggy high street? Using my car a minimum amount of time during the week doesn't mean I can't be disappointed with the impact of all this, right on my doorstep? The backed up traffic on Mayow Road, for instance, is much more noticeable in terms of noise level: car stereos, frustrated horn honking drivers etc can all be heard in my front room now!

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[Eagle]

Monica
I believe we all agree traffic congestion not good at all. However , in my experience , motorists soon adjust their routes as a result of traffic calming measures.

Hopefully in a few weeks will have calmed down. But it would be good if locals walked where ever possible . SE 26 not built for motorised transport.

It was mainly built in an era where The Railway was King.

[Rachael]

If people do want the lights etc to be looked at, they need to contact tfl. Grousing about it here isn't going to change anything.

[Tim Lund]

If people do want the lights etc to be looked at, they need to contact tfl. Grousing about it here isn't going to change anything.

There are a couple of TfL traffic modellers who live not far from me, who I chat to - about our gardens, generally. Next time I see them I'll ask them how much flows can be tweaked by changing signals, and what is involved in deciding this.

[FHS21]

The traffic is in part due to the rephrasing of the lights but is in the main due to the fact that you can no longer get off of the high street on to side roads except at mayow road or silverdale meaning everyone goes from one end to the other. In the past people could come off and double back on themselves onto mayow if just popping into sydenham. Long term not only will traffic readjust as commuters avoid the traffic thus reducing passing trade to shops but locals faced with a trip doubled in length and coupled with reduced ability to park on the high street itself (as being forced onto car park for short stop is almost always now the only parking option) they like me and others I know start to avoid the area completely. If you have to drive further and way a distance to the shop you want well you might as well got to sainsburys to be honest. Would be interested to know just how many of the established businesses are reporting increased trade now all this 'wonderful' redesigned layout has been put in place. Suggest much more likely to be reporting reduced trade both due to works period and now that it is complete.

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[hairybuddha]

I would also be interested to see the figures longer term. No one has yet managed to convince me that reduced traffic would have anything worse than a neutral effect on business here. The vast, vast majority of the traffic on the High St is going straight through and brings absolutely no benefit to the community. If you factor in the externalities like pollution, noise, anti-social driving then it is definitely a negative.

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[Rachael]

The traffic is in part due to the rephrasing of the lights but is in the main due to the fact that you can no longer get off of the high street on to side roads except at mayow road or silverdale meaning everyone goes from one end to the other. In the past people could come off and double back on themselves onto mayow if just popping into sydenham. Long term not only will traffic readjust as commuters avoid the traffic thus reducing passing trade to shops but locals faced with a trip doubled in length and coupled with reduced ability to park on the high street itself (as being forced onto car park for short stop is almost always now the only parking option) they like me and others I know start to avoid the area completely. If you have to drive further and way a distance to the shop you want well you might as well got to sainsburys to be honest. Would be interested to know just how many of the established businesses are reporting increased trade now all this 'wonderful' redesigned layout has been put in place. Suggest much more likely to be reporting reduced trade both due to works period and now that it is complete.

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But is the traffic on Sydenham Road itself any worse now, or is it the approach roads that we are concerned about (which are more affected by the phasing of lights)? I think it's correct that closing off the end of Queensthrope will certainly be increasing the amount of traffic on Sydenham Road itself, but not by much. If I park in Girton Road, I have to turn left onto Sydenham Road when I leave. Where before I would have then turned right onto Queensthorpe to get back to Mayow, I have to now carry on to Silverdale. But like I said, the traffic on Sydenham Road itself doesn't seem particularly worse, and I can't imagine that a few locals having to drive another minute up the road is adding much, when it's mostly through traffic, not local, on the road.

The overall effect of the new layout has neither increased nor decreased my likelihood of shopping on Sydenham Road. I have always used Girton Road if I need to park, as parking on Sydenham Road is just too much of a lottery. Finding a space is difficult, and if I do find a space, I am loath to reverse in, holding up all the traffic, so unless there is a big space to drive straight into, I tend not to bother. I don't really understand why people think parking in Girton Road is such a hardship. It's no more than two minutes walk from the main road. And it's free.

The main thing that stops me from using Sydenham Road for shopping is that there isn't a high enough concentration of shops that I want to use. It's that simple. Parking in Forest Hill is even more awkward than Sydenham, but there are shops there to entice me. It's worth the effort.

[hairybuddha]

To add to what Rachael has said, closing off the sidestreets has the wonderful effect of civilising the residential streets beyond. Sydenham is plagued with selfish rat running so if the downside of closures is a bit more traffic on the High St that's fine by me (and I'm sure by the majority of residents on those streets).

[FHS21]

Locals popping into sydenham to shop does not just mean those in roads adjacent to the high street. It was easier to park in sydenham than penge, forest hill or crystal palace. Therefore to drop into sydenham to grab something from say super drug and the post office was much simpler to do in sydenham than the other areas. If you have got to drive to a set of local shops and then sit in traffic to do, park further away and then drive longer through traffic to go home again you tend to choose the option of going somewhere else that you can actually do even more for the time expended. The only shops on the high street I see benefiting are those down at bell green end. I now go through to the mini mart down at st Philips for those little items I have forgotten, stop at the newsagents down by home park or simply say sod it and brave savacentre. The only reason I won't end up using the new pet shop at bell green is because I value the customer service at whites. New customers won't even bother stopping to try try them out.

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[FHS21]

To add to what Rachael has said, closing off the sidestreets has the wonderful effect of civilising the residential streets beyond. Sydenham is plagued with selfish rat running so if the downside of closures is a bit more traffic on the High St that's fine by me (and I'm sure by the majority of residents on those streets).

What I would say to those side street residents enjoying the quite roads is that's great but I hope you will enjoy the loss of your local high street as that becomes a nice quite road as well once the pass through traffic finds a new route and the existing shops close down.

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[hairybuddha]

What I would say to those side street residents enjoying the quite roads is that's great but I hope you will enjoy the loss of your local high street as that becomes a nice quite road as well once the pass through traffic finds a new route and the existing shops close down.

I find it very hard to believe that what you are describing will happen due to a couple of rat run closures. Rat run closures, by the way, that have been almost universally welcomed on here. But you are of course welcome to make the case.

Locals popping into sydenham to shop does not just mean those in roads adjacent to the high street. It was easier to park in sydenham than penge, forest hill or crystal palace

Locals "popping in" to Sydenham shouldn't be doing so in their bloody cars. That's the whole point. If the above speculation is correct, and the new road layout discourages excessive through traffic, then it will be a far better environment for the people that live here, rather than those who just want to transit it as quickly as possible. Then it might even become a place that people choose to pop in to without feeling the need to surround themselves in a lavishly upholstered steel cage.

[Robin Orton]

Locals "popping in" to Sydenham shouldn't be doing so in their bloody cars. [Etc, etc]

Your anti-car ranting, which seems increasingly to be dominating this forum, is becoming a little tedious, HB.

You are no doubt young and fit. Others are less so, and rely on their cars for shopping trips. Even for the more mobile, shopping for bulky or heavy items on foot is not a practicable proposition.

[hairybuddha]

Nothing anti-car about me Robin, as I have said many times. People abusing their car to the detriment of those around them? Definitely anti-that.

You are no doubt young and fit. Others are less so, and rely on their cars for shopping trips. Even for the more mobile, shopping for bulky or heavy items on foot is not a practicable proposition.

Of course there are plenty of people who need to use their cars Robin, that's fine. But the vast majority of people I see getting out of their cars on the High St either a) could and should have used an alternative mode of transport and b) could probably benefit from some more physical activity in their life as they waddle from Wimpy to the betting shop and back again. It's win win

People trying to shut down discussions that they don't like on here is definitely becoming tedious, Robin.

[Eagle]

I agree that fit people should be walking to the High Street. No one in Sydenham lives that far from Sydenham Road to need a car , unless of course they are handicapped or infirm.

The road alterations seem to have made more traffic in Silverdale and Mayow to the detriment of the residents in those roads.
Mainly because people cannot rat run through the Thorpe's any more.

I am inclined to believe traffic levels will soon reduce due to people finding alternative routings.

[Zoelee]

Traffic on Westwood Hill is definitely a lot worse... I can live with that as I walk everywhere, but it's the constant honking of car horns and blaring music from the drivers that has really made living in my house a bit (a lot) of an annoyance!

[Robin Orton]

People trying to shut down discussions that they don't like on here is definitely becoming tedious, Robin.

I was not of course 'trying to shut down discussion', HB, but merely to give you a hint. I am sure you will feel free to ignore it.

[hairybuddha]

Here's a hint for you Robin: Use the ignore button.

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[Robin Orton]

Here's a hint for you Robin: Use the ignore button.

Certainly not. You never know, I might miss something interesting!

[Rachael]

I have one poster here on my ignore list. Fairly sure I'm not missing anything interesting.

[Robin Orton]

I have one poster here on my ignore list. Fairly sure I'm not missing anything interesting.

So can't be HB, I'm sure, whose posts, on most subjects, are usually interesting and enlightening.