Can nothing be done about these anti-social cyclists?
They run the lights, ride illegally on the pavement, cycle while mouthing on their mobiles, and generally make a nuisance of themselves.
What's up with P.C.Plod? In their pockets, is he?
cyclists
Well as a cyclist I am now guilty of the first two sins.
I commuted into Central London for many years without the need to do it. But the recent madness of multiplying traffic lights by the dozen, lengthening the 'lighting cycle' two or three fold often having to wait while nobody crosses the road makes legal cycling a near impossibility if you want to get somewhere on time, without extra effort and as safely as possible.
The art of cycling is to try and achieve a cadence. Difficult enough with traffic. Impossible with the way TfL & Lewisham now administer our roads. That's why we keep on going or divert onto a footpath.
Another thing is that once you have disobeyed a red light for good reason, you tend to question everyone which is not a good idea and set an example for others. Some of our lawmakers forget that respect for the law requires it to be respectful back and not get in the way unnecessarily.
Oh and I won't go into the safety issues. The traffic planners are making the roads much more dangerous for all cyclists.
Mobile phones - well I agree that's bad. Not as bad as a motorist. One may kill himself, the other an innocent cyclist (unless he is cycling on the pavement:)
And we do want to persuade people on four wheels to swop to two surely?
Stuart (not in pay of anybody - sadly)
I commuted into Central London for many years without the need to do it. But the recent madness of multiplying traffic lights by the dozen, lengthening the 'lighting cycle' two or three fold often having to wait while nobody crosses the road makes legal cycling a near impossibility if you want to get somewhere on time, without extra effort and as safely as possible.
The art of cycling is to try and achieve a cadence. Difficult enough with traffic. Impossible with the way TfL & Lewisham now administer our roads. That's why we keep on going or divert onto a footpath.
Another thing is that once you have disobeyed a red light for good reason, you tend to question everyone which is not a good idea and set an example for others. Some of our lawmakers forget that respect for the law requires it to be respectful back and not get in the way unnecessarily.
Oh and I won't go into the safety issues. The traffic planners are making the roads much more dangerous for all cyclists.
Mobile phones - well I agree that's bad. Not as bad as a motorist. One may kill himself, the other an innocent cyclist (unless he is cycling on the pavement:)
And we do want to persuade people on four wheels to swop to two surely?
Stuart (not in pay of anybody - sadly)
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nork1
- Posts: 287
- Joined: 9 Jul 2006 12:49
- Location: Banned myself - can't be bothered with the Greg/Ulysses show anymore
I recently got myself a bike and I can hand on heart say I'm not guilty on all charges. It drives me mad seeing red lights being jumped... I stop because a)there's a red light and b)I'm unfit, I'm glad of the rest. I've had other cyclists shout at me for being in their way at red lights (this is usually met with a mouthful of abuse the appropriate hand signal).
Police won't do anything about cyclists - there's too much paperwork and it's now worth their while. Motorists on the other hand...
Police won't do anything about cyclists - there's too much paperwork and it's now worth their while. Motorists on the other hand...
Leave the cyclists alone!
I don't ride a bike. I'd love to, but it seems to be too dangerous. I am a driver and a pedestrian and I've only once had a cyclist give me grief and even though I'd done nothing wrong I weirdly felt on their side because I can imagine what its like to have everything against you!
Give the cyclists a break.
I don't ride a bike. I'd love to, but it seems to be too dangerous. I am a driver and a pedestrian and I've only once had a cyclist give me grief and even though I'd done nothing wrong I weirdly felt on their side because I can imagine what its like to have everything against you!
Give the cyclists a break.
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piano teacher
- Posts: 21
- Joined: 21 May 2007 15:13
- Location: sydenham
i feel safer on my bike than in my car but i do think that this area is full of danger spots for cyclists...i got knocked off a couple of years ago (by a driver on a phone) and broke my elbow and wrist...every time i go under the railway bridge by savacentre, where the traffic goes from 2 lanes 1 i can imagine being mashed one day...however when its warm and sunny its definitely the most pleasurable way to get around and often quicker than driving too
i have stayed in other european cities with cycle lanes everywhere it was lovely, except at peak periods when there was increased cycle rage
do i jump lights? yeah sometimes but only if i'm waiting for invisible pedestrians to cross
i nearly had an accident this morning when an idiot mini cooper driver missed my handlebar by about a milimetre
i have stayed in other european cities with cycle lanes everywhere it was lovely, except at peak periods when there was increased cycle rage
do i jump lights? yeah sometimes but only if i'm waiting for invisible pedestrians to cross
i nearly had an accident this morning when an idiot mini cooper driver missed my handlebar by about a milimetre
This is a classic argument against cyclists - undeniably the most vulnerable road users. As a cyclist of many years and also one time cycle courier I can provide hundreds of examples of how cars constantly flout the rules in similar ways. I often ask where PC Plod is when my left handlebar has been shaved by the wing mirror of an aggressive undertaking car, only for me to get back in front of them 50 yards later at the next light. And ask this - why is it that we have an acceptable speeding culture in this country? Speed cameras are universally hated even though they simply enforce sensible speed limits. Most drivers simply break before those white lines and accelerate on after, grinning to themselves. Why is this regarded with a schoolboy "getting away with it" glee, but yet cyclists are constantly held to task.
Drivers fail to realise just how threatening a car is. This is a large metal object with dangerous blind spots, loud sound systems, mobile phones, friends to talk to etc... all things that detract from the drivers concentration. Added to which we have a culture of speed where cars are highly tuned and capable of aggressive acceleration and high speeds un-needed on our speed-limited and traffic clogged roads. A key survival tactic of a cyclist is therefore to stay ahead of the traffic. That way they can retain some control over their road positioning. Sometimes this means jumping a light - certainly not right and proper, but often forgivable.
Unfortunately the press and the Clarkson dinosaurs of the world set it up as an us-versus-them situation. Lycra-louts? Well what about the drivers that take 10 lives a day on our streets? Most aren't petrol heads, they're lazy, impatient drivers like you and me. Give the cyclists a break. Until the majority of london drivers decide to make London roads a safer cycling environment, cyclists will have to be more ruthless in their survival tactics.
Drivers fail to realise just how threatening a car is. This is a large metal object with dangerous blind spots, loud sound systems, mobile phones, friends to talk to etc... all things that detract from the drivers concentration. Added to which we have a culture of speed where cars are highly tuned and capable of aggressive acceleration and high speeds un-needed on our speed-limited and traffic clogged roads. A key survival tactic of a cyclist is therefore to stay ahead of the traffic. That way they can retain some control over their road positioning. Sometimes this means jumping a light - certainly not right and proper, but often forgivable.
Unfortunately the press and the Clarkson dinosaurs of the world set it up as an us-versus-them situation. Lycra-louts? Well what about the drivers that take 10 lives a day on our streets? Most aren't petrol heads, they're lazy, impatient drivers like you and me. Give the cyclists a break. Until the majority of london drivers decide to make London roads a safer cycling environment, cyclists will have to be more ruthless in their survival tactics.
My perfect street is the naked street - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/b ... 221643.stm - let everyone go wherever they want and have faith that they'll all just get along
Yesterday a bus (the one you were on?) pulled out of a bus stop into my path while signalling 'left'. Buses are big, buses can kill. Should I call for a policeperson to ride shotgun on every TfL vehicle? Who pays?
Surely we should distinguish between behaviour which can be annoying to some people and that which causes real danger to innocent road users? Legality is a secondary issue which is there to clobber the latter but used with some discretion on the former.
I can't see where you are taking this Floom ...
Stuart
Surely we should distinguish between behaviour which can be annoying to some people and that which causes real danger to innocent road users? Legality is a secondary issue which is there to clobber the latter but used with some discretion on the former.
I can't see where you are taking this Floom ...
Stuart
Last edited by stuart on 10 Jul 2007 11:44, edited 1 time in total.
stuart: Should I call for a policeperson to ride shotgun on every TfL vehicle?
I wish there could be a policeperson on every bus, given the dirty habits that some passengers have, pestering everyone with unwanted music, chucking litter around, and sticking their filthy feet up on the seats where others have to sit.
You've got an idea there, stuart my mate!
I can see where Floom is coming from. I am a rural cyclist and a pedestrian when in the city, so I will try and make a reasoned and balanced comment.
I have nearly been hit, i would say around 5 times by cyclists , whilst legitimately using a pedestrian crossing in Sydenham. I have also been regularly forced to get out the way on pavements by youths riding 2 or 3-a- breast. All these experiences have made me feel slightly intimidated by speeding urban cyclists who have little or no regard for other peoples well-being.
However, like all of societies groupings, I'm sure that the majority of cyclists are considerate and law-abiding and it is hopefully a small (but very noticable) minority who are a real pain. It's probably the same with all road users. I tend to notice inconsiderate 4X4 drivers a lot, but that's to be expected, living in the wild savanah that is Sydenham.
I have nearly been hit, i would say around 5 times by cyclists , whilst legitimately using a pedestrian crossing in Sydenham. I have also been regularly forced to get out the way on pavements by youths riding 2 or 3-a- breast. All these experiences have made me feel slightly intimidated by speeding urban cyclists who have little or no regard for other peoples well-being.
However, like all of societies groupings, I'm sure that the majority of cyclists are considerate and law-abiding and it is hopefully a small (but very noticable) minority who are a real pain. It's probably the same with all road users. I tend to notice inconsiderate 4X4 drivers a lot, but that's to be expected, living in the wild savanah that is Sydenham.
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piano teacher
- Posts: 21
- Joined: 21 May 2007 15:13
- Location: sydenham
You know how cyclists sometimes swerve up onto the pavement to go round a line of cars in front of them?
personally i only usually do this for three reasons
a) the line of cars is too close to the pavement for me to get past them
b) there is dogshit that some owner thinks is more socially acceptable on the road than on the pavement
c) there is glass, if so some idiots think its safer to sweep it into the side of the road
and another thing...
pedestrians at crossings universally fail to cross where they're supposed to and cut diagonally across the road instead because its slightly quicker for them, this is a major irritation for cyclists
personally i only usually do this for three reasons
a) the line of cars is too close to the pavement for me to get past them
b) there is dogshit that some owner thinks is more socially acceptable on the road than on the pavement
c) there is glass, if so some idiots think its safer to sweep it into the side of the road
and another thing...
pedestrians at crossings universally fail to cross where they're supposed to and cut diagonally across the road instead because its slightly quicker for them, this is a major irritation for cyclists