Sticky music thread

[marymck]

Robin, I don't agree that Ralph McTell's singing in an American accent. And I think he has a lovely voice. He's Croydon tinged with Cornwall.

[youtubes]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Khln3dB0VU[/youtubes]

[marymck]

[youtubes]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DL2GmaI3Xus[/youtubes]

[Annie.]

I enjoyed that Annie, thank you - and I'm only half English! I haven't listened to Ralph McTell for years.

Speaking as someone who's wholly English, I must say I found it pretty cringe-inducing. And why does a song about England have to be sung in an American accent? 'Siddy streets', 'North - humber- land' etc.

I didnt insult your choice ,even though its not my taste, so please don,t insult my choice.I happen to be very proud of being English,not fashionable maybe in your eyes,Ralph McTell was born in Farnborough ,Kent, thats England isnt it?

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[Annie.]

[quote="marymck"]I enjoyed that Annie, thank you - and I'm only half English! I haven't listened to Ralph McTell for years.

Here's one you might like,reflecting my Irish half.

I was lucky enough to meet Phil Coulter back in the 90s, when Derry was pretty much as it is at the end of this song. We featured him and the song in a TV show I was working
on at the time.




That was really lovely Mary,it made the hairs on my arms stand up! I particualary liked it when he took the boys (his son?) hand at the end and showed him "home", my mothers side of the family came from Ireland too.

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[14BradfordRoad]

[youtubes]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DL2GmaI3Xus[/youtubes]

Thanks Mary,
Definitely a favourite.
Kirsty was absolutely fantastic both as songwriter and artist.
Shame she had to leave us so soon (far too soon), RIP Kirsty..

[Robin Orton]

I didnt insult your choice ,even though its not my taste, so please don,t insult my choice.I happen to be very proud of being English,not fashionable maybe in your eyes,Ralph McTell was born in Farnborough ,Kent, thats England isnt it?

I apologize, Annie, I shouldn't have used the aggressive expression 'cringe-inducing.' I failed to follow one of the basic rules for a civilised argument, that dissent should be expressed in graduated terms. (But I hope that it is nevertheless acceptable to express dissent on this forum - even over questions of taste!)

I'm sorry you don't like the Tompkins. I myself think the words are incredibly moving.It's the lament of a father for his dead son - particularly poignant when you remember that Absalom had been killed whilst leading a revolt against his father the king.

When David heard that Absalom was slain,
he went up into his chamber over the gate and wept,
and thus he said, O my son, my son,
would God I had died for thee, O Absalom my son!

As for Englishness, I too am proud to be English. Indeed, one of the reasons I love 'When David heard' is that it is so English - words from the Authorized Version of the Bible, music by one of the great masters of the English polyphonic school of the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries.

[Annie.]

I'm sorry Robin, I did find your music touching,
I reacted too quickly because you hurt my feelings.

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[marymck]

Here's another about the importance of English music ... I find this very moving.

[youtubes]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P5h4PFBuzvw[/youtubes])

[Annie.]

Excellent Mary,
I particularly liked the lines about over paid footballers, and its my flag too and I want it back ! :0))

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[Robin Orton]

Very interesting. Here are the lyrics, which I like:

Now it's been 25 years or more
I've roamed this land from shore to shore
From Tyne to Teign, or Severn to Thames
From moor to vale, from peak to fen

Played in cafes, pubs and bars
I've stood in the street with my own guitar
But I'd be richer than all the rest
If I had a pound for each request

For 'Duelling Banjos', 'American Pie'
It's enough to make you cry
'Rule Britannia', or 'Swing low...'
Are they the only songs we English know?

Seed, bark, flower, fruit
They're never gonna grow without their roots
Branch, stem, shoot
They need roots

After the speeches, when the cake's been cut
The disco's over and the bar is shut
At christening, birthday, wedding or wake
What can we sing 'til the morning breaks

When the Indians, Asians, Afro-Celts
It's in their blood, below their belt
They're playing and dancing all night long
So what have they got right that we've got wrong?

Seed, bark, flower, fruit
They're never gonna grow without their roots
Branch, stem, shoot
They need roots and

Haul away boys, let them go
Out in the wind and the rain and snow
We've lost more than we'll ever know
'Round the rocky shores of England
We need roots

And a minister said his vision of hell
Is three folk singers in a pub near Wales
Well, I've got a vision of urban sprawl
There's pubs where no-one ever sings at all

And everyone stares at a great big screen
Overpaid soccer stars, prancing teens
Australian soap, American rap
Estuary English, baseball caps

And we oughta be ashamed of all we walk
Of the way we look, at the way we talk
Without our stories or our songs

How will we know where we come from?
I've lost St. George and the Union Jack
That's my flag too and I want it back

Seed, bark, flower, fruit
Never gonna grow without their roots
Branch, stem, shoot
We need roots

Haul away boys, let them go
Out in the wind and the rain and snow
We've lost more than we'll ever know
'Round the rocky shores of England
We need roots...

Two points. First, although this song has got a sort of folk tinge to it, its primary idiom is not English but American.The syncopated rhythm or 'beat' is quite alien to traditional English folk music, as is the use of the guitar. In other words, it's an example of what it's complaining about.

Second, I know lots of English songs. Folk songs I learned at primary school, popular classics like 'Nymphs and Shepherds, Come Away' and the sort of comic songs we used to sing on family car journeys, on coach trips, and round camp fires - like 'Ilkley Moor Bah Tat' and 'Green Grow the Rushes O' . (OK , there were others which were probably American in origin, like 'The Darkies' Sunday School' and 'You'll Never Get to Heaven' (in an old Ford car, in a Sabre jet, with Miss Monroe, with a fat Girl Guide, etc), but they'd been pretty well Anglicised) Just the sort of songs to sing 'when the disco's over and the bar is shut.' Has that tradition completely disappeared?

[marymck]

Oh dear I was about to post another favourite song, but I'm afraid to now for having it ruined for me too, like happened with Shakespeare at school. The thing is that to me music is all about the emotions and I don't want to over analyse and pick songs apart as it just undermines how it makes me feel. Which I'm afraid is what's happened to me now with roots. With respect robin, I don't doubt your musical dissection but hope in time I can get your analysis out of my head so I can get my guttural feeling for the song back.

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[Robin Orton]

Oh dear, I am sorry about that, Mary. I agree with you that the appeal of music is largely emotional, but for me that doesn't mean it's not interesting to try to analyse how, in technical terms, it achieves its emotional effect. The same applies to poetry or painting.

I hope you will soon change your mind about posting another favourite song!

[Annie.]

Oh dear I was about to post another favourite song, but I'm afraid to now for having it ruined for me too, like happened with Shakespeare at school. The thing is that to me music is all about the emotions and I don't want to over analyse and pick songs apart as it just undermines how it makes me feel. Which I'm afraid is what's happened to me now with roots. With respect robin, I don't doubt your musical dissection but hope in time I can get your analysis out of my head so I can get my guttural feeling for the song back.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

I agree Mary,I just enjoy a song / music for how it makes me feel, i, m not interested in how it gets to me!
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[marymck]

OK not the one I was going to post (my hubby's criticism of Ray Davies - aka the sexiest man alive - is enough for me).

But I love this one ... I know Walter Huston wasn't the greatest singer in the world, but his is still my favourite version of this song.

[youtubes]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZdbX02ACFiE[/youtubes]

[Annie.]

[youtubes]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mUg5p3BncuQ[/youtubes]

I think this version is better Tim.

[Annie.]

[youtubes]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBmAPYkPeYU[/youtubes]


I loved Elvis so much when I was a teenager.
I,d wipe his sweat covered brow any day!

[Manwithaview1]

These guys should be the happiest people on the planet

[youtubes]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikGd2yoy9Is[/youtubes]

[Annie.]

[youtubes]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFAZ6TvK-3c[/youtubes]

One of the best singers of the last 10 years at least.

[Annie.]

These guys should be the happiest people on the planet

[youtubes]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikGd2yoy9Is[/youtubes]

Haha, yep they sure should be!

[Robin Orton]

Here's one of the English songs I mentioned. This pre-war recording by the Manchester Children's Choir was popular when I was a boy.
[youtubes]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfpPupGQUso[/youtubes]