Renewal of gas mains in Sydenham Rd - ring 020 8858 6910

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Tim Lund
Posts: 6718
Joined: 13 Mar 2008 18:10
Location: Silverdale

Renewal of gas mains in Sydenham Rd - ring 020 8858 6910

Post by Tim Lund »

This could be a nightmare, but Sydenham Traders and the Sydenham Society have been on to the Council about at least keeping people informed. One key fact is that it is Southern Gas Networks (SGN), not Lewisham, who call the shots, which is why I've put their phone number in the subject line.

I expect both SGN and Lewisham will be monitoring this site, hopefully even contributing, so can we make this a sticky admin? Comments from the community best short, sweet, factual or straightforwardly seeking factual information, such as "You said you would have finished this stretch by xxx. You haven't - can you tell us why?". Or "Why is nothing being done on this hole?"

This is a genuinely difficult and uncertain task - in an ideal world, people would know exactly what vital cables and other services there are under our roads and pavements, but no one does. So SGN cannot be sure how long this will all take. On the other hand, I'm sure some effective 'community engagement' will help keep SGN on their toes :)

To keep everyone informed, SGN have agreed to a maildrop to the whole of Sydenham Ward, for the first week of January, when works will apparently commence. In the meantime, here's what they were distributing at the Sydenham Assembly, Dec 4th.
From January 2009, Southern Gas Networks (SGN) will be renewing the gas mains along Sydenham Road, starting briefly east of Mayow Road before moving onto the area from Sydenham Station to 24 Sydenham Road. The work involves replacing the old metal mains with new plastic pipe, which has a lifespan of more than 80 years. SGN will carry out their work in phases in order to minimise disruption, and the high street as a whole should remain open for business throughout. At the moment, it is anticipated that the work will take 14 months in total; however, timescales may be subject to change dependent on progress made.

At the request of the Council, SGN are carrying out the gas works earlier than they had originally planned, in anticipation of Transport for London (TfL) agreeing to fund the proposed improvements to the high street.

Once work begins, local businesses will receive updates from SGN at monthly meetings. Residents will be kept informed via various channels that are likely to include the Local Assembly, the Council's and SGN's websites, notices in shop windows and local newsletters.

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At the same time as SGN's works get underway, Thames Water will be continuing their planned mains replacement works in the area, coming down Westwood Hill and Kirkdale to and through Cobbs Corner during January to March. Temporary traffic lights are likely to be needed when the works are taking place at Cobbs Corner roundabout.

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The Council cannot manage utility companies' works, so for specific queries about the activities of SGN or Thames Water when they begin, contact Gareth Lewis at SGN on 020 8858 6910 or McNicholas (Thames Water's contractor) on 020 8687 8350. Contacts for the Council's Transport Policy team are 020 8314 2020 or by email at transport@lewisham.gov.uk.
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bensonby
Posts: 1656
Joined: 18 Jun 2008 12:28
Location: Kent

Post by bensonby »

I'd like to know a specific timetable and what penalties will be imposed upon the gas company for overrunning on each section...
charlieandpip
Posts: 80
Joined: 22 Feb 2006 17:25
Location: Cator Road, Sydenham

Post by charlieandpip »

At the moment, it is anticipated that the work will take 14 months in total; however, timescales may be subject to change dependent on progress made.
14 months?!.....
Over a year?!.....

Unbelievable.

We have only just recovered from the replacement works that took place a couple of years ago.

I assume the street improvement works will be delayed as well as a result?
dickp
Posts: 567
Joined: 7 Jan 2005 14:39
Location: Cardiff

Post by dickp »

I sincerely hope they are better at project management than Thames Water were.

The dug across the entrance to my driveway, and didn't do any work in the hole for at least two weeks. I think this kind of thing was happening all over the borough.
coll
Posts: 192
Joined: 17 Oct 2007 15:55
Location: sydenham

Post by coll »

I’m from New York City and there the city governs when a road will be dug up. Gas, cable, Water companies and so-on are told ‘You will do this work at this time.’ Full stop! Yes, I’m aware the situation is different here. Here people moan and complain but nothing really gets done.

Its like those Sydenham assembly meetings, or what I like to call ‘The discussion of discussions to discuss the planning of discussions of further discussions to discuss what to discuss.’

And yes, I know, American’s have a reputation for this annoying shiny smiley ‘You can do it’ attitude. But sometimes, not often, that attitude actually helps accomplish things.

I’m sure I’ll get a lot of flack for this but, come on people DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS. I’ve lived here for 5 years and the high street and Kirkdale have been dug up 3 times each. Isn’t it a basic human right to be able to live without these endless ‘essential works’ interruptions. People’s way of life and livelihoods are at the total mercy of whom ever decides to dig the roads up.

I’ve watched the work being done on Kirkdale. It is done at snail’s pace – if any work is being done at all. Why is there seemingly no monitoring of this – and I don’t mean some council official overseeing it. Why are we as local residents not documenting how slowly and inefficiently this work is being done, taking that information and demanding the council deals with this properly.

Lastly, is it just me or have anyone else noticed the signs around Jews Walk? They read, ‘Major Gas Works Jews Walk.’ Are they serious? Does anyone think?
I’m really sorry if I’ve offended anyone. :wink:
ALIB
Posts: 1553
Joined: 12 Oct 2006 21:34
Location: East Sussex

Post by ALIB »

I have some comments to make regarding these works. (I have no connection with Lewisham or SGN). Several issues should be noted.

1) Lewisham has no real influence on when these works are conducted or how long they take.

2) The practical problems of replacing aged underground services are many and include...
Discovery of additional unrecorded services
Staff working hours/health and safety issues
Sourcing of parts for any additional works
etc.

The works also have to take into account access for traffic and pedestrians and other concerns relate to timing the delivery of tarmac/concrete and waiting for it to set.

I think the key here is communication. The contractors liaising effectively with traders and Town Centre Manager to provide information as to what is happening and when. Likewise giving the contractors feedback (positive and negative) will be beneficial to all.


Ali B
bensonby
Posts: 1656
Joined: 18 Jun 2008 12:28
Location: Kent

Post by bensonby »

coll wrote: come on people DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS.
like what?

Isn’t it a basic human right to be able to live without these endless ‘essential works’ interruptions.
No, not really, what part of the HRA would it come under?
Rebelmc
Posts: 172
Joined: 8 Feb 2006 14:38
Location: Sydenham

Post by Rebelmc »

bensonby wrote:
coll wrote: come on people DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS.
like what?

Isn’t it a basic human right to be able to live without these endless ‘essential works’ interruptions.
No, not really, what part of the HRA would it come under?
Like you adopt the American model, the same one that most other civilised countries work to; do road works at the times when most people aren't using the roads.

I completely agree with Coll, we have no idea how to work on roads; we dig them up at any old time we please, cause all kinds of disruption for an inordinate amount of time, then tell everyone the works were completed in less time than was expected and expect everyone to be happy with that.

A good example is the works on Westwood Hill; they spent months doing stuff involving temporary traffic lights and jams all over the region (despite the fact that I rarely saw anyone doing any actual work) then, as soon as Christmas is due and all the roadworkers want to get home to their families, the work is done and the lights disappear, at exactly the point when everyone is on holiday and the odd set of lights won't cause any difficulty.

The problem is, we're work shy and greedy; OK, pay a little bit more for unsociable hours, but make roadworker's jobs nightime hours and make the buggers work for a living, not have a tea break whenever they want.
ALIB
Posts: 1553
Joined: 12 Oct 2006 21:34
Location: East Sussex

Post by ALIB »

Wing
Posts: 141
Joined: 9 Oct 2006 15:11
Location: Sydenham Hill

Post by Wing »

I overheard a gas mains workman saying that Crystal Palace Parade is being planned for major gas mains works and that could extend all the way to Westwood Hill/Crystal Palace Park Road.
newbrit
Posts: 34
Joined: 6 Jan 2009 16:57
Location: Sydenham

Post by newbrit »

We have seen workers leaving the place during what should be considered working hours, only to come back and work on weekends. If the Council pays, the Council is entitled to set working conditions and timetables. If the Council does not pay, then whoever does should stop and think, and get the value for money we all deserve (which means public works finished on time AND on budget). We cannot be at the mercy of bad management!
dickp
Posts: 567
Joined: 7 Jan 2005 14:39
Location: Cardiff

Post by dickp »

On several occasions, the generators have packed up over the weekend, causing the temorary traffic lights to fail. When you're narrowing traffic down to a single lane over long-distance roadworks, this is a recipe for traffic chaos.

I've called the phone number on the boards to report the problem, but of course no one answers over the weekend. Idiots.
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