Just got a letter from the council informing me of a proposal to set up bus stop clearways and parking restrictions on Newlands Park.This will reduce the number of street parking for residents ,already under pressure from people parking to use Penge East station and Sydenham and from workers at the metropolitian police workshop in Newlands park.
I think Newlands park needs measures to slow down traffic on this residential road and feel that these proposals will do the exact opposite and change the character of the road into something away from residential towards something faster and more dangerous.
thoughts?
Bus stop clearways on Newlands Park
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stone-penge
- Posts: 292
- Joined: 5 Nov 2004 14:40
- Location: Newlands park
Two points. Firstly as you drive into Newlands Park form the high street there would be a lot less congestion if that bl***y stupid parking bay was removed that sits just pass what was Volkspares. If that bay was removed the traffic would flow a lot easier as very few people park on the left going downhill.
Secondly turning left into Lennard road from Newlands park there needs to be double yellow lines on the left.This is to stop the twats that park there with no common sense or regard for the buses that frequent this route. There are such bad hold-ups at this bottle neck that vehicles are now using Westbourne road and Maitland road as a rat-run. Maitland road is an unspoilt road with a children's play area. An accident is inevitable unless something is done. Perhaps make Maitland road a cul de sac. ANGRY OF MAITLAND ROAD.
Secondly turning left into Lennard road from Newlands park there needs to be double yellow lines on the left.This is to stop the twats that park there with no common sense or regard for the buses that frequent this route. There are such bad hold-ups at this bottle neck that vehicles are now using Westbourne road and Maitland road as a rat-run. Maitland road is an unspoilt road with a children's play area. An accident is inevitable unless something is done. Perhaps make Maitland road a cul de sac. ANGRY OF MAITLAND ROAD.
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stone-penge
- Posts: 292
- Joined: 5 Nov 2004 14:40
- Location: Newlands park
That bottle neck on Lennards road is getting worse, I think reducing parking spaces further up Newlands Park may make it worse.
And yes BB I am in the borough of Bromley. The council tried a proposal a year or two ago to issue permit parking on Newlands Park, this was rejected by popular demand, this bus stop clearway will remove parking from the front of the parade of shops in NP and from the street oppersite the police workshop plus yellow lines around the road intersections up from there towards Sydenham high street.
And yes BB I am in the borough of Bromley. The council tried a proposal a year or two ago to issue permit parking on Newlands Park, this was rejected by popular demand, this bus stop clearway will remove parking from the front of the parade of shops in NP and from the street oppersite the police workshop plus yellow lines around the road intersections up from there towards Sydenham high street.
Stone Penge,
Forget letter - I just got a flyer through the door when the proposal directly effects me, no prior consultation or anything - sort of like hitchhikers guide to the galaxy where there was no fore warning to the earths destruction as the notification was buried in the depths of some alien planning department.
I agree with posts here, there are other more sensible simple measures could be taken to improve our quality of life as residents.
I lament that there does not seem to be any joined up thinking with these officials. Between London Buses and Planning coming up with measures that dont seem to be fully thought out. Examples of such greats are: the bus lane in Kirkdale, the crossing over the bridge by the station and now classing a residential road as if its a high street. Anybody got any more?
What about community consultation? - does any bureaucrat think about what we need? At the end of the day its all about putting a finger up in the are and coming up with a random answer, they obviously have money to burn at the moment, probably from the enforced parking restrictions in Penge. So why not do something sensible with it.
MW
Ps I forgot the other classic by TFL - Oyster cards works on tube and buses - overground forget it. Result higher costs for Overground users. Eh Hello havent you forgotten somebody....
Forget letter - I just got a flyer through the door when the proposal directly effects me, no prior consultation or anything - sort of like hitchhikers guide to the galaxy where there was no fore warning to the earths destruction as the notification was buried in the depths of some alien planning department.
I agree with posts here, there are other more sensible simple measures could be taken to improve our quality of life as residents.
I lament that there does not seem to be any joined up thinking with these officials. Between London Buses and Planning coming up with measures that dont seem to be fully thought out. Examples of such greats are: the bus lane in Kirkdale, the crossing over the bridge by the station and now classing a residential road as if its a high street. Anybody got any more?
What about community consultation? - does any bureaucrat think about what we need? At the end of the day its all about putting a finger up in the are and coming up with a random answer, they obviously have money to burn at the moment, probably from the enforced parking restrictions in Penge. So why not do something sensible with it.
MW
Ps I forgot the other classic by TFL - Oyster cards works on tube and buses - overground forget it. Result higher costs for Overground users. Eh Hello havent you forgotten somebody....
Mrs Woman (and others)
This proposal is currently out for consultation by both LBL and LBB and all the residents along Newlands Park will receive a consultation letter and a plan of the proposal.
So what are we actually talking about here?
1. Yellow lines on the junctions of both Tredown road and Tannsfeld Road where they meet Newlands - both of these are congested junctions and are difficult to get in and out of.
2. Two bus stops (on either side of the road by the small parade of shops close to Tannsfeld Road) will have 24 hour bus stop clearways to prevent cars and other vehicles parking on the bus stops.
That's it! Hardly earth shattering is it?
Yes there are other bottlenecks but these seem eminently sensible suggestions. Why shoot them down?
This proposal is currently out for consultation by both LBL and LBB and all the residents along Newlands Park will receive a consultation letter and a plan of the proposal.
So what are we actually talking about here?
1. Yellow lines on the junctions of both Tredown road and Tannsfeld Road where they meet Newlands - both of these are congested junctions and are difficult to get in and out of.
2. Two bus stops (on either side of the road by the small parade of shops close to Tannsfeld Road) will have 24 hour bus stop clearways to prevent cars and other vehicles parking on the bus stops.
That's it! Hardly earth shattering is it?
Yes there are other bottlenecks but these seem eminently sensible suggestions. Why shoot them down?
Nasaroc,
Are you a resident on Newlands Park? Are you directly personally affected by this proposal. You seem quite relaxed. Maybe you live off Newlands park and dont realise that cars looking for space may try and park down your road. Maybe you dont drive, not immobile and havent got kids so couldnt care less. Lucky you.
Well, it may not be impacting you as much as it affects me, this time.
Newlands Park is residential not a high street why have such a long bus clearway and 24 hours - eh the buses dont run 24 hours.
I think if they are going to do this they should make it all residential parking here and stop the people working at the police station and commuters using our parking space.
"...Yes there are other bottlenecks but these seem eminently sensible suggestions. Why shoot them down?..." - But Its not a case of shooting the proposals down. These initiatives may initally seem sensible on the onset but the implementation and result in reality can be otherwise.
Are you a resident on Newlands Park? Are you directly personally affected by this proposal. You seem quite relaxed. Maybe you live off Newlands park and dont realise that cars looking for space may try and park down your road. Maybe you dont drive, not immobile and havent got kids so couldnt care less. Lucky you.
Well, it may not be impacting you as much as it affects me, this time.
Newlands Park is residential not a high street why have such a long bus clearway and 24 hours - eh the buses dont run 24 hours.
I think if they are going to do this they should make it all residential parking here and stop the people working at the police station and commuters using our parking space.
"...Yes there are other bottlenecks but these seem eminently sensible suggestions. Why shoot them down?..." - But Its not a case of shooting the proposals down. These initiatives may initally seem sensible on the onset but the implementation and result in reality can be otherwise.
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stone-penge
- Posts: 292
- Joined: 5 Nov 2004 14:40
- Location: Newlands park
If you look at the north bound bus stop(heading towards Sydenham) there is already 30m+ of clearway 'upstream' of the bus stop by nature of the fact that all the properties have dropped kerbs and off street parking. Why they want need to move the bus stop and lose more parking space is beyond me.nasaroc wrote:Mrs Woman (and others)
This proposal is currently out for consultation by both LBL and LBB and all the residents along Newlands Park will receive a consultation letter and a plan of the proposal.
So what are we actually talking about here?
1. Yellow lines on the junctions of both Tredown road and Tannsfeld Road where they meet Newlands - both of these are congested junctions and are difficult to get in and out of.
2. Two bus stops (on either side of the road by the small parade of shops close to Tannsfeld Road) will have 24 hour bus stop clearways to prevent cars and other vehicles parking on the bus stops.
That's it! Hardly earth shattering is it?
Yes there are other bottlenecks but these seem eminently sensible suggestions. Why shoot them down?
Mrs Woman
If you feel your area should be residential parking, then you must get the majority of your neighbours to agree with this. When LBB surveyed local residents living in the LBB on this side of Penge East station to ask if they wanted such a scheme, the idea was soundly defeated. This was less than two years ago.
Why is there a need for controls to stop parking on bus lanes? Because local residents park all over the existing stop. Yesterday evening at 7.30pm the whole of the bus stop outside the shopping parade was filled with parked cars?
Why a need for a 24 hour control? Because buses along this stretch currently operate 21.5 hours per day (the first 75 bus stops here at approx 4.35am and the last bus at approx 1.45pm).
If you feel your area should be residential parking, then you must get the majority of your neighbours to agree with this. When LBB surveyed local residents living in the LBB on this side of Penge East station to ask if they wanted such a scheme, the idea was soundly defeated. This was less than two years ago.
Why is there a need for controls to stop parking on bus lanes? Because local residents park all over the existing stop. Yesterday evening at 7.30pm the whole of the bus stop outside the shopping parade was filled with parked cars?
Why a need for a 24 hour control? Because buses along this stretch currently operate 21.5 hours per day (the first 75 bus stops here at approx 4.35am and the last bus at approx 1.45pm).
Dear Nasaroc,
I am unsure that you realise how your email is being interpreted by myself. I dont like being told what I must do and I would prefer that you refrain to post further emails directed at myself as I am not getting into a personal argument with you.
I didnt request a lecture, and I dislike pontification at the best of times. I merely pointed out the length of the bus clearway and that this is a residential road. I personally think the measures are totally over the top and not fully thought out.
Regards
MW [/quote]
I am unsure that you realise how your email is being interpreted by myself. I dont like being told what I must do and I would prefer that you refrain to post further emails directed at myself as I am not getting into a personal argument with you.
I didnt request a lecture, and I dislike pontification at the best of times. I merely pointed out the length of the bus clearway and that this is a residential road. I personally think the measures are totally over the top and not fully thought out.
Regards
MW [/quote]
I’ve just looked at the background papers from which this proposal originates. The proposal is being asked for by London Transport in large part because their drivers are reporting that the existing bus stop (the one outside the parade of shops close to the end of Tannsfeld Road) is almost always full of cars parked illegally on the stop.
If people can’t behave reasonably (and this illegal parking is also happening overnight, so the culprits can’t all be commuters) then you simply can’t blame the authorities for implementing this scheme.
I shall be writing to LBL and LBB and to local councillors in both Sydenham and Penge welcoming this scheme and I’d recommend that others do the same.
If people can’t behave reasonably (and this illegal parking is also happening overnight, so the culprits can’t all be commuters) then you simply can’t blame the authorities for implementing this scheme.
I shall be writing to LBL and LBB and to local councillors in both Sydenham and Penge welcoming this scheme and I’d recommend that others do the same.
Very Interesting information, good to get some background. I thought things would get better in that corner when the second hand car retailer shut up shop. Nasaroc welcomes the proposals for that particular bus stop and I object to the enforcement on the other bus stop. We perhaps disagree on different points.
I feel an enforced parking restiction on that parade of shops will be their death knell. I imagine it must be hard to survive as it is. Nothing like some boarded up shops to give the street some cred.
Hmm I also think the proposal needs to be pared down and will be writing to LBL and LBB and local councillors stating same and request further consideration on traffic calming measures and a crossing too.
Thanks for the recommendation.
MW
I feel an enforced parking restiction on that parade of shops will be their death knell. I imagine it must be hard to survive as it is. Nothing like some boarded up shops to give the street some cred.
Hmm I also think the proposal needs to be pared down and will be writing to LBL and LBB and local councillors stating same and request further consideration on traffic calming measures and a crossing too.
Thanks for the recommendation.
MW
Newlands park
Is it that car repair/sale place which is causing all the trouble? They probably have cars they are mending/selling parked there overnight too. I know I find it a hard junction to emerge out of because of the parked cars and vans, but agree some short-term parking should be kept for the shops.
Poppy - you make an excellent point about needing to provide some short-term parking for the shops. Mrs Woman is also concerned about the survival of these shops.
Perhaps 2-3 half-hour only parking bays next to the new bus stop for shoppers would be the best solution - just like we have in and around Sydenham Road?
What say you Mrs Woman? If you are concerned about the future of the shops why not include this as part of the new scheme?
Perhaps 2-3 half-hour only parking bays next to the new bus stop for shoppers would be the best solution - just like we have in and around Sydenham Road?
What say you Mrs Woman? If you are concerned about the future of the shops why not include this as part of the new scheme?
Yes, I am all for joined up thinking. I never park directly at a bus stop nor do I park at the edge of the junction, this was something I learnt prior to passing my driving test, and is part of the highway code.
This is how I now see it. Looking at the section of road this proposal affects, break it down and view each bus stop separately.
Bus Stop 1: The driveways roughly start opposite the parade of shops and carry up the road for a couple of hundred metres, at either end of this all the properties have gardens and kerbs to park at. Moving this particular bus stop and taking away more kerb will add to the parking congestion at this section of the road, which is where my concern lies. At present there is plenty of space for the bus to pull up at this bus stop.
Bus Stop 2: This section of road at the parade of shops is congested with people badly parking at the bus stop and junctions, which is further compounded by the car repair/retail shop. Reduction of parking could cause a negative impact on the shops trade.
In summary, If the proposal is primarily to resolve the parking at the bus stop at the parade of shops. I want the bus stop at my end to remain where it is.
The bus stop at the parade of shops doesnt directly impact me, and I wouldnt want to hasten the demise of those shops. Though I would not advocate parking bays anywhere other than directly outside those shops. I also think that this would put even more pressure on residents parking on the road.
Nasaroc, Poppy It would be great if we could have a result that we all be happy with.
MW
This is how I now see it. Looking at the section of road this proposal affects, break it down and view each bus stop separately.
Bus Stop 1: The driveways roughly start opposite the parade of shops and carry up the road for a couple of hundred metres, at either end of this all the properties have gardens and kerbs to park at. Moving this particular bus stop and taking away more kerb will add to the parking congestion at this section of the road, which is where my concern lies. At present there is plenty of space for the bus to pull up at this bus stop.
Bus Stop 2: This section of road at the parade of shops is congested with people badly parking at the bus stop and junctions, which is further compounded by the car repair/retail shop. Reduction of parking could cause a negative impact on the shops trade.
In summary, If the proposal is primarily to resolve the parking at the bus stop at the parade of shops. I want the bus stop at my end to remain where it is.
The bus stop at the parade of shops doesnt directly impact me, and I wouldnt want to hasten the demise of those shops. Though I would not advocate parking bays anywhere other than directly outside those shops. I also think that this would put even more pressure on residents parking on the road.
Nasaroc, Poppy It would be great if we could have a result that we all be happy with.
MW
TfL do not control mainline trains and cannot make Southern, for example, accept Oyster cards or set what fares they charge.mrs woman wrote:Ps I forgot the other classic by TFL - Oyster cards works on tube and buses - overground forget it. Result higher costs for Overground users. Eh Hello havent you forgotten somebody....
The old North London Line (Silverlink) came under TfL control in November 2007 and is now branded by them as "London Overground". This will be added to with the extension of the East London line in 2010.
Have a look here and inform yourself
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/modalpages/6310.aspx
hi there,
Indeed its interesting reading all of your posts on this topic of bus stops etc down Newlands Park.
I am a resident on this road and I must say that my Primary concern wih the buses down this 'residential' road is the speed of the darn things. That coupled with all the other traffic at peak times it si becoming somewhat of a nightmare. I have lived on Newlands PArk for 2 and a half years now and the traffic situation in this area is simply getting worse and worse.
I would simply like to offer my full support if required in any form to slow down/ reduce/ block off?!! (perhaps a bit harsh!) traffic down this road.
Speed bumps is what I would ideally like to see. I would be intersted in what others think about this...
Cheers,
Tom
Indeed its interesting reading all of your posts on this topic of bus stops etc down Newlands Park.
I am a resident on this road and I must say that my Primary concern wih the buses down this 'residential' road is the speed of the darn things. That coupled with all the other traffic at peak times it si becoming somewhat of a nightmare. I have lived on Newlands PArk for 2 and a half years now and the traffic situation in this area is simply getting worse and worse.
I would simply like to offer my full support if required in any form to slow down/ reduce/ block off?!! (perhaps a bit harsh!) traffic down this road.
Speed bumps is what I would ideally like to see. I would be intersted in what others think about this...
Cheers,
Tom
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stone-penge
- Posts: 292
- Joined: 5 Nov 2004 14:40
- Location: Newlands park
I agree with you Tommy, what this road needs is ideas to produce traffic calming measures not wacking great bus clearways that will, intentionally or otherwise serve to create the opportunity for irresponsible drivers to travel at even greater speeds down this road, never mind these bus stops changing the character of the roadscape away from a residential nature into a high street /clearway type of road, to the detriment of the people who have to live here.TommyP wrote:hi there,
Indeed its interesting reading all of your posts on this topic of bus stops etc down Newlands Park.
I am a resident on this road and I must say that my Primary concern wih the buses down this 'residential' road is the speed of the darn things. That coupled with all the other traffic at peak times it si becoming somewhat of a nightmare. I have lived on Newlands PArk for 2 and a half years now and the traffic situation in this area is simply getting worse and worse.
I would simply like to offer my full support if required in any form to slow down/ reduce/ block off?!! (perhaps a bit harsh!) traffic down this road.
Speed bumps is what I would ideally like to see. I would be intersted in what others think about this...
Cheers,
Tom
If you look at more forward thinking town planners there is a tendency to move away from over regulation of the roadscape and encourage a idea of a more shared road between cars and pedestrians and the residents.Creating gaudy no-stop zones and restricting parking to improve sightways at junctions will only encourage less caution and more speed on Newlands Park.
I advise everyone who will be effected to write to Bromley Council to reject this measure.
Stone Penge and Tommy
Let's try to introduce a note of reality into this discussion.
We surely have to face up to the fact that Newlands Park isn't some backwater. It's a throroughfare - the "main road" between central Sydenham and Penge - with major bus routes along its length. It isn't enough to say that it's residential (tell me a road in SE26 that isn't) or that there's more traffic going down the road than two years ago (tell me a road in SE26 where this isn't the case).
I'm all for restricting the motor car. But I'm not silly enough to believe that the local population will accept that you should "block off" this road as Tommy would clearly like to.
Don't hide away from the central issue of this scheme. Are you in favour of allowing Newlands Park residents to park all over bus stops and within 10m of road junctions. If you aren't how do you intend to stop this.
Road calming is an entirely separate (and perfectly sensible)discussion. But the one we are discussing here is whether buses should be free to stop at bus stops which are free of illegally parked cars.
Let's try to introduce a note of reality into this discussion.
We surely have to face up to the fact that Newlands Park isn't some backwater. It's a throroughfare - the "main road" between central Sydenham and Penge - with major bus routes along its length. It isn't enough to say that it's residential (tell me a road in SE26 that isn't) or that there's more traffic going down the road than two years ago (tell me a road in SE26 where this isn't the case).
I'm all for restricting the motor car. But I'm not silly enough to believe that the local population will accept that you should "block off" this road as Tommy would clearly like to.
Don't hide away from the central issue of this scheme. Are you in favour of allowing Newlands Park residents to park all over bus stops and within 10m of road junctions. If you aren't how do you intend to stop this.
Road calming is an entirely separate (and perfectly sensible)discussion. But the one we are discussing here is whether buses should be free to stop at bus stops which are free of illegally parked cars.