VIBRANT* HIGH STREET

[leenewham]

Create a culture of innovation and ideas, support it and great things will happen.

This is partly why the West Norwood Feast is so good for the area. It has led to this:
http://www.jumbletrail.com/event/Se27feast

People are expanding on the Feast by having a massive jumble sale by hosting tables outside peoples houses in street surrounding the high street.

I think it's a great idea (it's buzzing on social media) and it's the sort to things I'd have hoped SEE3 in Sydenham would be coming up with, who have gone very quiet as late and who still haven't properly promoted the markets.

Return back to the first line and re-read.

[Annie.]

That's a great idea Lee, where I am you pay the parish council to put you on a map for a garage sale once a year,
people buy the maps and the money goes to the local village hall which has a three drop in days a week where people have tea and biscuits for 50p it's a great way to meet new people, they also sell bric a brac which is donated by anyone who no longer wants the item, again the proceeds go to the community.

[Bunty]

What a great idea. I am on Newlands Park and would love to do this and see a traffic free road for the day too maybe?!

[Joanne]

Create a culture of innovation and ideas, support it and great things will happen.

This is partly why the West Norwood Feast is so good for the area. It has led to this:
http://www.jumbletrail.com/event/Se27feast

People are expanding on the Feast by having a massive jumble sale by hosting tables outside peoples houses in street surrounding the high street.

I think it's a great idea (it's buzzing on social media) and it's the sort to things I'd have hoped SEE3 in Sydenham would be coming up with, who have gone very quiet as late and who still haven't properly promoted the markets.

Return back to the first line and re-read.

Lee,

Joanne here.

I've rejoined the forum to reply. Perhaps enjoyable at a local level, a once off event too but this idea would not help Sydenham High Street.

Possibly if we had a well advertised and well run market, serving as an anchor point, it could but we do not. The High street is completely disconnected.

SEE3 were given a brilliant opportunity to initiate change here and this became a lost one. The market is an important example.

Alongside this not one Pop Up shop worked in Sydenham- if they did then they'd still be in operation. Instead we are left with empty shops in off the beaten track locations, graffiti and empty promises based on lack of experience, a very amateur approach which cost a lot of public money.

This was an opportunity to create a buzz and sustainability anchored in what locals need- that was the Portas Pilot aim. We have not even received an evaluation.

I'd say the fact SEE3 'have gone very quiet as late' is a serious understatement.

I'm amazed that they didn't see the potential at Cobbs Corner, the number of vacant shops available. A sensible move would have been to create a cluster of Pop Up's in close proximity to each other. Well chosen products in order to have broad appeal. An opportunity lost to attract new footfall plus encouraging new businesses to open in Sydenham.

It's certainly influenced my choices about where I set up a business, despite living locally and I know that I'm not alone here!

Notice that On The Hoof is already very quiet- weeks after they have opened still have no signage! That's crazy and not helping matters.

Back to your idea Lee, no I don't think a street jumble sale will add value to Sydenham High Street.
I think getting the market right would now be a good start point. All elements are wrong! As a shopper it feels positively awkward there. I'll end up buying something or other just because you can sense the dismay of the stallholder!

[Manwithaview1]

That's a great idea Lee, where I am you pay the parish council to put you on a map for a garage sale once a year,
people buy the maps and the money goes to the local village hall which has a three drop in days a week where people have tea and biscuits for 50p it's a great way to meet new people, they also sell bric a brac which is donated by anyone who no longer wants the item, again the proceeds go to the community.

Excellent idea. Is the whole area where you are doing garage sales on the same day?

[Annie.]

Yes, they pay I think its £5.00 to the parish council who draw up a map of the village and where the garage sales are, then the public pay £2.00 to the parish council for the completed map, all the money made on the maps goes to the hall.

A great idea I thought, it also helps get to know each other.

[Manwithaview1]

Yes, they pay I think its £5.00 to the parish council who draw up a map of the village and where the garage sales are, then the public pay £2.00 to the parish council for the completed map, all the money made on the maps goes to the hall.

A great idea I thought, it also helps get to know each other.

Sydenham Garage Sale Day would be tremendous. It is always positive to share good ideas that benefit the community.

[Pally]

Create a culture of innovation and ideas, support it and great things will happen.

This is partly why the West Norwood Feast is so good for the area. It has led to this:
http://www.jumbletrail.com/event/Se27feast

People are expanding on the Feast by having a massive jumble sale by hosting tables outside peoples houses in street surrounding the high street.

I think it's a great idea (it's buzzing on social media) and it's the sort to things I'd have hoped SEE3 in Sydenham would be coming up with, who have gone very quiet as late and who still haven't properly promoted the markets.

Return back to the first line and re-read.

Lee,

Joanne here.

I've rejoined the forum to reply. Perhaps enjoyable at a local level, a once off event too but this idea would not help Sydenham High Street.

Possibly if we had a well advertised and well run market, serving as an anchor point, it could but we do not. The High street is completely disconnected.

SEE3 were given a brilliant opportunity to initiate change here and this became a lost one. The market is an important example.

Alongside this not one Pop Up shop worked in Sydenham- if they did then they'd still be in operation. Instead we are left with empty shops in off the beaten track locations, graffiti and empty promises based on lack of experience, a very amateur approach which cost a lot of public money.

This was an opportunity to create a buzz and sustainability anchored in what locals need- that was the Portas Pilot aim. We have not even received an evaluation.

I'd say the fact SEE3 'have gone very quiet as late' is a serious understatement.

I'm amazed that they didn't see the potential at Cobbs Corner, the number of vacant shops available. A sensible move would have been to create a cluster of Pop Up's in close proximity to each other. Well chosen products in order to have broad appeal. An opportunity lost to attract new footfall plus encouraging new businesses to open in Sydenham.

It's certainly influenced my choices about where I set up a business, despite living locally and I know that I'm not alone here!

Notice that On The Hoof is already very quiet- weeks after they have opened still have no signage! That's crazy and not helping matters.

Back to your idea Lee, no I don't think a street jumble sale will add value to Sydenham High Street.
I think getting the market right would now be a good start point. All elements are wrong! As a shopper it feels positively awkward there. I'll end up buying something or other just because you can sense the dismay of the stallholder!

I regularly see similar comments to this re the lack of momentum etc with SEE 3 ...and your comments make sense Joanne. I just don't know how things can be moved on ...and I never see any response from confessed SEE 3 members!!

I have to agree about the Pop ups; such a shame and yes there was clearly a lack of experience involved as evidenced with some of them. A real shame. What a good idea re Cobbs Corner

What I don't understand is why, when there are so many interested people with good ideas popping up on this forum, there isn't a chance to all those ideas to feed into SEE 3 plans, developments etc. I cant identify what is supposed to be building the momentum...

[Manwithaview1]

Another thing that needs to be addressed is the daily addition of pigeon droppings in shop entrances. Maybe netting over the whole of the flats above the shops would help.

[leenewham]

Joanne,

Every post you you make is negative. The first line of my post was 'create a culture of ideas and innovation and support it and great things will happen'. Yet. Every incentive you rally against.

1. the pop ups in sydenham were not a failure. You dont understand pop ups. You cant just go to any shop and automatically get them as a pop up. I Know louise tried bloody hard to get the best sites. But not all landlords are helpful. Many pop ups help to cultivate interest in an are area the refitted shops create a legacy for other businesses. They are there, mostly to help people trial their businesses. Some of the pop up businesses were more viable than others, often pop ups dont last but the businesses gain valuable experience for the future with little risk. They arent just about getting long term pop ups to stay in the same shop. 161, cherry and ice, the vintage shop in kirkdale all benefitted from the refits, as did the one in station approach, and i know there was interest in the other shops too. It didnt cost a lot of public money. Compaired to other schemes I've seen, it was pretty good value.

2. See 3 instigated the market. Its now run by lewisham, but there are problems which i hope they will solve, like the awkward layout and poor promotion.

3. On the hoof are not quiet. Im not sure why younthink they are. The signage is in hand but there are some possible changes which has delayed it (I'm sure ela wont mind me saying this). Have you actually been joanne? Try it, it's fantastic, as the reviews on here testify.

4. The jumble sale is an idea that grew out of the west norwood feast (i dont claim it to be my idea). The west norwood feast is one of the best local initiatives in any high street in london. I think expanding it to the surrounding streets is a great idea for both the high street and the local comunity. I think its an idea worth looking at and possibly trying rather than just dismissing out of hand. Try things, they might work, its a lot better than typing negativity to anything and everything anyone trys to do around here.

See3 has been quiet in sydenham, but the funding ran for a period of time. It is sitting on some funding, im not sure why, but i hope it once again becomes a vehicle for doing things that can help. Smetimes you just have to try things joanne, some thigns may work, some thigns might not last. Are your pop ups still running as businesses joanne?

How about some ideas for how to make things better?

[mosy]

...[clip]...I cant identify what is supposed to be building the momentum...

Repeat custom is why shops survive. Yes, people might travel to Sydenham for a decent nosh, but would they travel here to buy a twice yearly pair of shoes, or a piece of retro furniture? New shops also have to be something that's not already there, or it just takes business away, or spreads the same business around. I reckon Kirkdale ought to do better (than it does longevity-wise) for niche shops. Of course, if no money in pocket to spend...

@leenewham, I think I'm the only one I know who buys quirky eclectic mixes of secondhand things - trust me, a jumble trail wouldn't appeal to everyone by any stretch of the imagination (in terms of actually spending money), though as a one-off it could work (assuming licences etc paid for and granted), Are any highways and walkways actually available? It's not really a "staying power" attraction though is it?

I'd be in favour (as I've said) if Venner and Queensthorpe Squares were daily of one sort of another e.g. antiques & bric-a-brac or boot sale, farmers market fruit/veg, street food, textiles maybe (clothing or housewares), crafts or whatever, that people would get to know as to which day.
At least more frequently than 1-day/month. It makes sense to me to make more of the potential that's there already.

[Pally]

Joanne,

Every post you you make is negative. The first line of my post was 'create a culture of ideas and innovation and support it and great things will happen'. Yet. Every incentive you rally against.

1. the pop ups in sydenham were not a failure. You dont understand pop ups. You cant just go to any shop and automatically get them as a pop up. I Know louise tried bloody hard to get the best sites. But not all landlords are helpful. Many pop ups help to cultivate interest in an are area the refitted shops create a legacy for other businesses. They are there, mostly to help people trial their businesses. Some of the pop up businesses were more viable than others, often pop ups dont last but the businesses gain valuable experience for the future with little risk. They arent just about getting long term pop ups to stay in the same shop. 161, cherry and ice, the vintage shop in kirkdale all benefitted from the refits, as did the one in station approach, and i know there was interest in the other shops too. It didnt cost a lot of public money. Compaired to other schemes I've seen, it was pretty good value.

2. See 3 instigated the market. Its now run by lewisham, but there are problems which i hope they will solve, like the awkward layout and poor promotion.

3. On the hoof are not quiet. Im not sure why younthink they are. The signage is in hand but there are some possible changes which has delayed it (I'm sure ela wont mind me saying this). Have you actually been joanne? Try it, it's fantastic, as the reviews on here testify.

4. The jumble sale is an idea that grew out of the west norwood feast (i dont claim it to be my idea). The west norwood feast is one of the best local initiatives in any high street in london. I think expanding it to the surrounding streets is a great idea for both the high street and the local comunity. I think its an idea worth looking at and possibly trying rather than just dismissing out of hand. Try things, they might work, its a lot better than typing negativity to anything and everything anyone trys to do around here.

See3 has been quiet in sydenham, but the funding ran for a period of time. It is sitting on some funding, im not sure why, but i hope it once again becomes a vehicle for doing things that can help. Smetimes you just have to try things joanne, some thigns may work, some thigns might not last. Are your pop ups still running as businesses joanne?

How about some ideas for how to make things better?

Thanks for this information Lee. I wasn't aware of all this.

As an aside, Sydenham stores seems to be making a success in station approach in an old pop up, despite being another food store. They are helpful polite and very friendly!

[Joanne]

Joanne,

Every post you you make is negative. The first line of my post was 'create a culture of ideas and innovation and support it and great things will happen'. Yet. Every incentive you rally against.

1. the pop ups in sydenham were not a failure. You dont understand pop ups. You cant just go to any shop and automatically get them as a pop up. I Know louise tried bloody hard to get the best sites. But not all landlords are helpful. Many pop ups help to cultivate interest in an are area the refitted shops create a legacy for other businesses. They are there, mostly to help people trial their businesses. Some of the pop up businesses were more viable than others, often pop ups dont last but the businesses gain valuable experience for the future with little risk. They arent just about getting long term pop ups to stay in the same shop. 161, cherry and ice, the vintage shop in kirkdale all benefitted from the refits, as did the one in station approach, and i know there was interest in the other shops too. It didnt cost a lot of public money. Compaired to other schemes I've seen, it was pretty good value.

2. See 3 instigated the market. Its now run by lewisham, but there are problems which i hope they will solve, like the awkward layout and poor promotion.

3. On the hoof are not quiet. Im not sure why younthink they are. The signage is in hand but there are some possible changes which has delayed it (I'm sure ela wont mind me saying this). Have you actually been joanne? Try it, it's fantastic, as the reviews on here testify.

4. The jumble sale is an idea that grew out of the west norwood feast (i dont claim it to be my idea). The west norwood feast is one of the best local initiatives in any high street in london. I think expanding it to the surrounding streets is a great idea for both the high street and the local comunity. I think its an idea worth looking at and possibly trying rather than just dismissing out of hand. Try things, they might work, its a lot better than typing negativity to anything and everything anyone trys to do around here.

See3 has been quiet in sydenham, but the funding ran for a period of time. It is sitting on some funding, im not sure why, but i hope it once again becomes a vehicle for doing things that can help. Smetimes you just have to try things joanne, some thigns may work, some thigns might not last. Are your pop ups still running as businesses joanne?

How about some ideas for how to make things better?

Hi Lee,

I think if SEE3 provided us with a full breakdown of expenditures it would enable us to evaluate for ourselves the areas of their project which worked and those which did less well.

Once we have this it will be easier to identify the gaps and inform what should happen next. That I think is the start point. It feels as if we don't have a foundation to work from.

We could even be forgiven for thinking that SEE3 no longer even exist- there has been no news for a very long period, evidenced by their out of date web site.

My aim here is to be constructive. You mention that I 'don't understand pop ups' but it would be fairly concerning if I don't since facilitating Pop Ups represents 50% of our business. We have developed a tried and tested formula which works- this includes being self sufficient to set up a new shop in less than a week, signage included, marketing in place etc.

When we are in a location we source all our business needs locally, form working relationships with local businesses and Partnerships with like-minded organisations. We attract a high footfall- to give you an idea- in 8 weeks in region of 1500 at current one- a proportion of our newly collected database will then follow us to our next location/ new audience.

Vital points include:

- prime location on High Street- good footfall- near the station etc- no point being off the beaten track when budgets are limited and only a potential short window period to trade. Must work asap

- set up quickly (almost overnight) without fanfare- that helps attract immediate curiosity, interest. No blow by blow blogs about each step this involves- painting the walls, electrics- that's just boring and defeats objective

- don't outsource that costs money- be self sufficient

- quickly integrate with localaity

- press releases: know who and how best to contact

- adapt product to location e.g. we run Pop Up Art Galleries- what may work well in say Blackheath may not in Shoreditch. Horses for courses

- create social value

- relationship with Landlord crucial- make it an attractive proposition- ensure to mutual benefit

Sydenham:

As I mentioned in my original post it baffles me why SEE3 did not focus their attention on the empty shops at Cobbs corner. At the time there were a row of empty shops opposite LA fitness. Syd Vintage used their own initiative to open their own Pop Up in the largest shop.

I understand that Pop Ups by their very nature may not stay for long (that's why they can work!). But Sydenham's didn't work due to a whole load of reasons, this includes, management, location and choice of product.

Instead of learning from this and creating an improved rolling Pop Up programme for new businesses to trial we are left with a legacy of empty shops with signage getting tattier by the day.

Not to mention the graffiti! SEE3 introduced this when the Council were simultaneously removing it. I'm not a huge fan of street art but I think it can have its place if executed well, has meaning too and in a subtle location! It's a creative process though and not something a management team, without artistic acumen should be introducing to be cool. That's just naive.

Just to go back to your original post which I know is well intentioned- which you always appear to be. I didn't actually mean to sound dismissive but our focus should be on achieving ideas which are sustainable to improve and help the High Street thrive.

I think the Market and getting those Pop Up shops up and running again must be the focus right now.

I notice Chris Best has now introduced Morris Dancing to the next market. That will be one further reason why I will not be attending!

For the last 8 weeks, each Sunday I've been visiting a Farmers Market in Blackheath Village (we have had a Pop Up Gallery there). This is an excellent market, but it's also very relaxing to visit- there are no gimmicks!!

[Pally]

Joanne,

Every post you you make is negative. The first line of my post was 'create a culture of ideas and innovation and support it and great things will happen'. Yet. Every incentive you rally against.

1. the pop ups in sydenham were not a failure. You dont understand pop ups. You cant just go to any shop and automatically get them as a pop up. I Know louise tried bloody hard to get the best sites. But not all landlords are helpful. Many pop ups help to cultivate interest in an are area the refitted shops create a legacy for other businesses. They are there, mostly to help people trial their businesses. Some of the pop up businesses were more viable than others, often pop ups dont last but the businesses gain valuable experience for the future with little risk. They arent just about getting long term pop ups to stay in the same shop. 161, cherry and ice, the vintage shop in kirkdale all benefitted from the refits, as did the one in station approach, and i know there was interest in the other shops too. It didnt cost a lot of public money. Compaired to other schemes I've seen, it was pretty good value.

2. See 3 instigated the market. Its now run by lewisham, but there are problems which i hope they will solve, like the awkward layout and poor promotion.

3. On the hoof are not quiet. Im not sure why younthink they are. The signage is in hand but there are some possible changes which has delayed it (I'm sure ela wont mind me saying this). Have you actually been joanne? Try it, it's fantastic, as the reviews on here testify.

4. The jumble sale is an idea that grew out of the west norwood feast (i dont claim it to be my idea). The west norwood feast is one of the best local initiatives in any high street in london. I think expanding it to the surrounding streets is a great idea for both the high street and the local comunity. I think its an idea worth looking at and possibly trying rather than just dismissing out of hand. Try things, they might work, its a lot better than typing negativity to anything and everything anyone trys to do around here.

See3 has been quiet in sydenham, but the funding ran for a period of time. It is sitting on some funding, im not sure why, but i hope it once again becomes a vehicle for doing things that can help. Smetimes you just have to try things joanne, some thigns may work, some thigns might not last. Are your pop ups still running as businesses joanne?

How about some ideas for how to make things better?

Hi Lee,

I think if SEE3 provided us with a full breakdown of expenditures it would enable us to evaluate for ourselves the areas of their project which worked and those which did less well.

Once we have this it will be easier to identify the gaps and inform what should happen next. That I think is the start point. It feels as if we don't have a foundation to work from.

We could even be forgiven for thinking that SEE3 no longer even exist- there has been no news for a very long period, evidenced by their out of date web site.

My aim here is to be constructive. You mention that I 'don't understand pop ups' but it would be fairly concerning if I don't since facilitating Pop Ups represents 50% of our business. We have developed a tried and tested formula which works- this includes being self sufficient to set up a new shop in less than a week, signage included, marketing in place etc.

When we are in a location we source all our business needs locally, form working relationships with local businesses and Partnerships with like-minded organisations. We attract a high footfall- to give you an idea- in 8 weeks in region of 1500 at current one- a proportion of our newly collected database will then follow us to our next location/ new audience.

Vital points include:

- prime location on High Street- good footfall- near the station etc- no point being off the beaten track when budgets are limited and only a potential short window period to trade. Must work asap

- set up quickly (almost overnight) without fanfare- that helps attract immediate curiosity, interest. No blow by blow blogs about each step this involves- painting the walls, electrics- that's just boring and defeats objective

- don't outsource that costs money- be self sufficient

- quickly integrate with localaity

- press releases: know who and how best to contact

- adapt product to location e.g. we run Pop Up Art Galleries- what may work well in say Blackheath may not in Shoreditch. Horses for courses

- create social value

- relationship with Landlord crucial- make it an attractive proposition- ensure to mutual benefit

Sydenham:

As I mentioned in my original post it baffles me why SEE3 did not focus their attention on the empty shops at Cobbs corner. At the time there were a row of empty shops opposite LA fitness. Syd Vintage used their own initiative to open their own Pop Up in the largest shop.

I understand that Pop Ups by their very nature may not stay for long (that's why they can work!). But Sydenham's didn't work due to a whole load of reasons, this includes, management, location and choice of product.

Instead of learning from this and creating an improved rolling Pop Up programme for new businesses to trial we are left with a legacy of empty shops with signage getting tattier by the day.

Not to mention the graffiti! SEE3 introduced this when the Council were simultaneously removing it. I'm not a huge fan of street art but I think it can have its place if executed well, has meaning too and in a subtle location! It's a creative process though and not something a management team, without artistic acumen should be introducing to be cool. That's just naive.

Just to go back to your original post which I know is well intentioned- which you always appear to be. I didn't actually mean to sound dismissive but our focus should be on achieving ideas which are sustainable to improve and help the High Street thrive.

I think the Market and getting those Pop Up shops up and running again must be the focus right now.

I notice Chris Best has now introduced Morris Dancing to the next market. That will be one further reason why I will not be attending!

For the last 8 weeks, each Sunday I've been visiting a Farmers Market in Blackheath Village (we have had a Pop Up Gallery there). This is an excellent market, but it's also very relaxing to visit- there are no gimmicks!!

Reading all this with little knowledge of the background but a genuine interest in Sydenham, it strikes me that you both make good points which all in the end come back to not much seems to be happening! I just don't understand why its gone quiet (which is what I meant re being unable to identify where the momentum for improvement is supposed to be coming from)

I do agree that Morris Dancing in a market that isn't really working fir all the reasons mentioned in previous posts/threads) is not going to bring in the punters!

I am also aware that there will be lots of people who have tried or are trying to get things going and so any comments including my own can seem / feel negative and dispiriting. Talking to various people including shop keepers, there seems to be a general sense of disillusionment and that comes over on the forumas well! . But I still don't know how it gets moved on ...noone from SEE3 seems to respond on this forum and I'm not sure where Councillors fit in this whole arrangement either.

[Joanne]

Recently I wrote to the Director of Sydenham Arts thinking this might be a way forward to discuss ideas.

I was trying to describe that we might be able to help but unfortunately he has not replied. He is clearly looking for input though- see recent posts.

SEE3 have even recently spoken at a Pop Up conference to offer advice!

I think they are literally mad to not have some presence on this forum and pro-actively draw on support from those who are willing and have experience (the later they don't).

[safdirector]

Jonathan Kaufman, Director of Sydenham Arts here. I have not received an email from Joanne, or if I have she didn't use that name. Please can she contact me at director@sydenhamartsfestival.co.uk

And it was my idea to invite the Wild Hunt Bedlam Morris outfit to next Saturday's Sydenham market. This is a very interesting, Croydon-based group who are keeping a great British tradition alive in an innovative fashion. Come along and find out for yourselves, Sat 11 Oct, 1pm-4pm. They will be performing on the hour at Queensthorpe Square and Venner Square, space permitting.

http://www.wildhunt.org.uk/index.php

regards
Jonathan Kaufman
Director, Sydenham Arts

[Joanne]

Thanks Jonathon for letting me know you didn't receive- have resent to address above letter dated 29 Aug'14. Joanne

[leenewham]

I was hoping this may lead to some great idea to make things better, which is why I started with 'Create a culture of innovation and ideas, support it and great things will happen.'

Well done to Jonathan for getting involved, yet again, and making positive things happen.

So, what ideas do people have to create a vibrant* high street?

*This is the most overused word used about high streets, I and it normally doesn't apply to any that (usually politicians) describe as vibrant. But meetings and discussions about high streets are better if they are vibrant, exciting, passionate, lively and enthusiastic. Different people have different views and as ever it's not a single issue solution. Problems need to be defined, solutions formed and actions taken.

Ideas on a post…please

[Annie.]

If I were still in Sudenham I would come to the market if there were some kind of music being played each time, I think the Morris dancers are a good idea, as you say Lee, tradition!
As long as the music is not overpowering I think it will always draw people in to the market.
I haven't seen the layout of stalls so I am trying to imagine it, but if it's not user friendly as appears to be being suggested than perhaps this needs to be looked at?

[Joanne]

I was hoping this may lead to some great idea to make things better, which is why I started with 'Create a culture of innovation and ideas, support it and great things will happen.'

Well done to Jonathan for getting involved, yet again, and making positive things happen.

So, what ideas do people have to create a vibrant* high street?

*This is the most overused word used about high streets, I and it normally doesn't apply to any that (usually politicians) describe as vibrant. But meetings and discussions about high streets are better if they are vibrant, exciting, passionate, lively and enthusiastic. Different people have different views and as ever it's not a single issue solution. Problems need to be defined, solutions formed and actions taken.

Ideas on a post…please

Apologies Lee but this is all sounding rather naïve… exactly what we need to step away from…

The focus instead needs to be:

- An evaluation from SEE3 (as mentioned above)

- Improved Management of the Market (without gimmicks like Morris Dancing & Drumming workshops)- clearly does not bring in customers. It’s hardly conducive to a relaxing shopping experience either.

- Get an improved rolling Pop Up shop programme running & in time to hit busy trading period Nov-Dec inclusive